Shed Geek Podcast
The Shed Geek Podcast offers an in depth analysis of the ever growing and robust Shed Industry. Listeners will experience a variety of guests who identify or specialize in particular niche areas of the Shed Industry. You will be engaged as you hear amateur and professional personalities discuss topics such as: Shed hauling, sales, marketing, Rent to Own, shed history, shed faith, and much more. Host Shannon Latham is a self proclaimed "Shed Geek" who attempts to take you through discussions that are as exciting as the industry itself. Listeners of this podcast include those who play a role directly or indirectly with the Shed Industry itself.
Shed Geek Podcast
Sheds & St. Jude: Building More Than Storage Solutions
What happens when life's greatest challenge becomes your greatest stepping stone? In this powerful conversation, Darren Warren, President and CEO of Stor-Mor Portable Buildings, shares his remarkable journey from a 16-year-old cancer patient with a 40% survival rate to becoming an innovative leader in the shed industry.
Darren's story begins in 1998 when his non-Hodgkin's lymphoma diagnosis led his father to start building portable sheds—allowing young Darren to participate in the family business while undergoing 120 chemotherapy treatments at St. Jude Children's Research Hospital. What started as a solution to a family crisis evolved into a passion and eventually, industry leadership with a people-first approach.
"It's our people, it's our people, it's our people," Darren emphasizes as the true secret to Stor-Mor's success. This isn't just a catchphrase but a deeply held belief that has shaped their business decisions—including the surprising choice to dismantle their in-house online sales department to funnel leads to their dealers instead, resulting in a $1 million sales increase in just one month.
The conversation dives into the shed industry's evolution beyond "just building boxes," exploring vertical integration, product diversification into post-frame buildings and carports, and the crucial balance between online and brick-and-mortar sales. Darren warns against the "race to the bottom" pricing strategies while advocating for quality, service, and innovation as the path forward.
Perhaps most compelling is Darren's unwavering commitment to purpose beyond profit. "Between God and St. Jude, I'm here," he states, explaining why charitable initiatives remain central to Stor-Mor's identity. This commitment extends to his vision for the industry—calling for greater collaboration among competitors to establish ethical practices and combat growing fraud concerns.
Whether you're in the shed industry or simply appreciate stories of resilience and purpose-driven leadership, this episode offers valuable insights on transforming personal challenges into stepping stones for helping others. As Darren poignantly asks, "What's the glory in making all the money and seeing no one else's life be better around you?"
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Studio Sponsor: Shed Pro
Okay, all right, welcome back to another episode of the shed geek podcast. Excited about, uh, yet again another episode and just here to be uh, present, attentive and focused on this conversation with Darren today. But, Darren, just introduce yourself as if people don't know who you are. Some might not, well, let's tell them.
Darren:Thank you so much, first of all, for coming by. We really do appreciate that, and I mean that.
Darren:I appreciate you coming by and allowing us to do this. I think it's been something that's great for the industry. And I mean that I appreciate you coming by and allowing us to do this. It's a I think it's been something that's great for the industry. So, I'm Darren Warren and I'm not real big on titles, but President, CEO of a Stor-M or Portable Buildings. So anyway, as I said, we appreciate you coming by, man, and giving us the opportunity to kind of talk a little bit about something that's a love of our life building sheds, a love of many people's life isn't it.
Shannon:We find ourselves in this unique space. People say sheds Like what do you mean? Like backyard sheds? We're like, yeah, and they're like a podcast and I'm like, yeah, it's a real thing, man.
Darren:We even have celebrations, parties and trade shows. All about this whole little is idea of storage funny. Yeah, how so many people don't understand when we, when we talk about sheds, most people are okay, the storage units right self-storage units you know, what I'm saying so yeah, anyway, I was doing a speaking at an event at saint jude and I called it the shed show and the whole room busted out laughing. You know what I'm saying.
Shannon:What's a Shed Show Shed.
Darren:Show what's that. But I said hey, it's an industry man.
Shannon:It's a real deal. It's become a real industry, so it's pretty cool. It's definitely been fun. Well, speaking on that, how did you land in this? I say this on the podcast a lot People don't just typically grow up necessarily. Now maybe a couple in the shed industry second, third generation folks that grew up with it and say, hey, this is what I want to do, but we all kind of fall into it. What was your story?
Darren:sure, well, it started actually back in about 1999 and my dad was in construction and he would own a company. Still, the business is still around here better built garages, better built buildings and uh so in 1998 I was actually diagnosed with non-hodgkin's lymphoma.
Darren:Okay, and uh, knowing, uh, at that point I was diagnosed with non-hodgkin's lymphoma, Baptist hospital in Paducah and they, uh, they gave me less than a 40% chance of survival rate.
Darren:But they said we don't treat many kids like you. We want to send you to St Jude Children's Research Hospital in Memphis, Tennessee. So they did, and at that time, with the prognosis not being too good and realizing I was going to be sick for a while, my dad went to my mom and said hey, I've been thinking about building some sheds, some little portable units, because if Darren's going to be going through this treatment for two and a half years 120 chemotherapy treatments he probably I always enjoyed working said he probably can't be out, don't need to be out in the sun in the hot. So, dad started building some sheds in about sometime around 1999,. So, dad started building some sheds in about sometime around 1999, and we carried on with that through 2008. And in 2008, unfortunately, my oldest brother was murdered and at that point my dad literally about lost his mind, and so he kind of wanted to get out of the shed.
Darren:Business at that point, a lot of pressure on the dad, absolutely it was a lot of pressure on him and mom and full transparency man. We weren't the most organized at it back in that day you know what I'm saying? We didn't have some of the tools and some of the help. I mean, that's just being honest we yeah you know, we, we had our own, we had our own, uh, struggles of organization and things like that. But dad got out, sold off a lot of the parts actually Better Built Structures in Oklahoma still part of that and there's still some parts of it that still continue on.
Darren:Yeah, so I got at that point. I got off into the pole barn business and some metal business and stuff like that, and then in 2017, I always tried to stay in the rent-to-own side of it a little bit. You know what I'm saying, the rent-to-own investing. But then in 2017, we decided that I was going to get back into the business and that's when Chris Burnett came to me and we sat down and collaborated and decided that we would open up a Stor-M or in 2017 and do that on a joint venture. So, it's been so good, it's been so fun, man that's.
Shannon:I'll tell you what, if you can, you can say that at the end of the day and really just the aura that comes off of you, the, the, the appreciation, less than 40 I'm gonna, I'm gonna touch base there. Less than 40, my wife's here with us, she's, you know we're, we're big, uh, fans of, uh, early prevention. We know how much that played a role in her journey.
Shannon:Oh yeah, um, and you know, even to the point where my, my terrible weekend uh to say the least, was you know to, to an attempt to try and, like um, remedy that if you will? But, man, I'm going to tell you how impactful it is to know that she went through 12 rounds of chemo and it was is that right? Twelve months, twelve months. Yeah, I don't remember how many rounds, but 120.
Darren:120. Wow.
Shannon:Once every week.
Darren:Yeah, yeah, you know it's a lot of things that come back when we start talking about that. I remember I've told this story quite a bit, but I remember when we did wind up at St Jude Hospital, our prognosis there was quite a bit better than what we got in Paducah our survival rate. But I remember walking up to the back of that hospital, you know, and getting ready to walk in and a lot of things. A 16-year-old kid, not just a 16-year-old kid, a lot of things in life, all of us, you just don't understand things sometimes. I remember walking up to the back of that hospital and Dad grabbing my hands and saying hang on, just a minute before we walk in, I want to say a little prayer. I remember looking up at the back of that hospital and I remember saying God, why am I here? Why did you put me in this hell? Why am I here?
Darren:And I've said this a lot, but little did I know that that hell on earth would become a heaven on earth for me, man, and would be something that would change my life forever.
Darren:I don't ever want to go back through it, Right, but I think it started teaching me things in life along the lines of am I going to make this a stumbling block for the rest of my life and am I going to stumble over this and just trip over it? Will I have this come my way and it's not fair and it's not this, or am I going to make this a stepping stone? Am I going to make it a stepping stone to try to make a difference in others' lives and my life? And nobody's perfect man. I would fall the furthest from that, trust me. But I really feel like I've tried to take my life and be like you know what, no matter what comes my way, let's try to make it instead of a stumbling block. Let's try to make it a stepping stone to realizing that, that we can overcome things and, with the help of God, we can. We can, you know, turn some lemons into lemonade.
Shannon:I don't know what you would do without faith. I've heard pastors say you know you don't believe that there's a God. You've got more faith than I do because the evidence to me makes more sense you know, to have the faith in Jesus Christ and man.
Shannon:Sometimes for me, just a little blip on the radar, like this last week for me, was enough to straighten out your viewpoint a little bit on a couple of different things, and you can stray along the way. I've watched your story. I want to get this on record. I want to say this officially Thank you. When me and my wife were going through the breast cancer that she had to deal with that I just tried to play a supporting role in, there was a GoFundMe account given back, created back then, and you gave to that. I want to say thank you for that and you even called and checked up. I think afterwards that speaks volumes to the kindness of our industry. When we have all the stuff, Darren, we have all the stuff that every industry has Absolutely the fraud, the backbiting, the, the, everything that you could imagine, Uh, but we have a lot of good stuff too in this industry.
Darren:You know, I mentioned to you before we went on, we went on the air here to talk about I mentioned to you about when we decided to get into the business again. Chris asked me one time back in 2017, said out of everything in the manufacturing world that you've seen, what would you change? And I said attitudes. He said out of everything attitudes. I'll never forget saying that because he was so shocked. But it is. You know, there is. But out of all of that, sometimes we still have an awesome industry, man, yeah, and we still have a lot of people that support one another, and I think it all boils down to what do you want to look at? Do you want to look at the glass half empty? Do you want to look at it half full? You're always going to have we're aware I said this a while ago we're always going to compete, we're always going to be competitors and, uh, you know, but at the end of the day, I don't think that's no grounds for us not to be friends.
Shannon:That's right, that's right. No, I agree, man kudos. Well said, congratulations first on you know, taking this, uh, this terrible thing, and turning it into a stepping stone and not getting hung up there. That's a hard thing to do.
Darren:I don't believe in a lot of luck, but I tell people all the time I'm the most lucky and the blessed gal in the same breath. I don't understand, but we've sure been blessed a lot.
Shannon:You know you get one life, and your life serves as testimony of how a lot of that's played out. Now, 27 years later, sitting here today not that it's important to sit here with me on the podcast, but to be able to share your story, I think it is.
Darren:I think it's very important. Well, I appreciate that, by the way. I think this is where our industry is heading.
Shannon:We're seeing such a.
Darren:It's so cool to see it evolve, remember. I mean, let's be real, our industry is still a little back from most industries. We're in a lot of technology in the industry still it's getting there, but not a lot of technology. A lot of technology in the industry still it's getting there, but not a lot of technology. But I think people are learning that these type of podcasts, all the online sales, all the stuff that we're seeing over time, is really where our industry is headed. And I would even say this for the industry If you're not supporting that, I'd say this for competition, for ourselves, no matter what, if we're not supporting that, we're probably going to be, um, falling behind a little bit, because the industry is evolving very quickly and I and I love it. Man, yeah, I'm not a tech savvy guy. The girls know, they all know they make fun of me. I'm not a tech savvy guy, but I can sit and tell you what I want, right, but uh, but it is it's, it's a. It's ever evolving in a good way, in my opinion.
Shannon:Well, I'll tell you what, Contrary to popular belief, you know I started doing a lot of blue-collar stuff. You know my dad would hustle and work at a kitty litter plant he's a maintenance person, you know and mowed yards, hustled on the side and made us mow yards. You because of that, subsequently, if my dad took a job, that meant we took a job introducing shed hub, your ultimate shed marketplace. Are you in the shed business and looking to connect with more buyers? Look no farther than shed hub. Shed hub is a game-changing two-sided marketplace that brings shed sellers and buyers together in one easy-to-use platform. Think of it as the Amazon of sheds.
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Darren:It's so funny to hear you talk about that. I've told this story different times too. So my dad and I was born in 82. Okay, but my dad went broke in 82 right at the time I was born pig farming.
Darren:Okay talking about mowing yards made me so my dad didn't feel right about filing bankruptcy so he wouldn't. They sold the farm, sold all the assets and he still owed money. So, he got a note with the bank and went to work for my uncles building houses. And so, when we got up, old enough, of course we I was five years old, six years old me and mom and my brothers would mow yards to help buy groceries and things while dad worked for my uncle building houses. And I'll never forget I wasn't tall enough to reach the you know where you used to pull the handle, to hold the handle down and start to mow, and you'd push it so the second level on the handle down. Here they would tie a handkerchief around the top and I would push the bottom bar and help mow yards. So, it's a lot of good memories Talking about mowing yards.
Shannon:Some of those go back a long way. I mean, I remember, yeah, I remember best I could do was push, mow something and try to help out, you know, and we'd go as a family and do those hustles. I was talking about this earlier. I said, you know I maybe mentioned this too many times on the podcast, but I think my dad, when he retired, made 10 bucks an hour. Wow, you know, like neither one of them made more than ten dollars an hour.
Darren:Uh, I think my dad was making nine dollars an hour. My uncle Ron told him one day said Duane, pray to God to make you rich and we'll keep you humble, is what he told you. I guess with that pay he's gonna keep you mumble, so I love that saying.
Shannon:I gotta remember that.
Darren:So, I think it was pray to God. I believe that was right. Pray to God to give you strength or make you rich, and we'll keep you humble.
Shannon:I think that's what it was my mom used to always say if you pray for patience, you'll be given the opportunity. Oh yeah, for patience always say if you pray for patience you'll be given the opportunity for patience. Be, careful what you pray for. So, it's yeah. I mean, you know we're not so all that different. We're two years apart and really, you know, just on the other side of the river.
Darren:Absolutely. Really kind of where I grew up you know, you know, this side of the river is pretty much believed, though, where God started creating the world right.
Shannon:So, the other side was a little later on. Just to be clear, I was born on this side of the river so it might not be so wrong, you know.
Shannon:We stayed true to our roots. We stuck around, and Baptist is where I started. Yeah, I know that story. So, man, I see Stor-M or just everywhere. I see you guys just doing amazing things. Um, there's some obvious leaders in the industry. Like you said before, we all compete. Sure, we're all trying to make a bigger pie. You know we don't have to take. We'll have to take everything. Things are moving and we'll get into the online stuff and all that. We can go down that rabbit hole for sure. But what do you think is the recipe for that success? I just see you guys growing and I'm impressed. Your dealers are always so kind. They've always welcomed us in. Yeah, just good people.
Darren:You know, I had a guy who was actually a competitor stop me this year at the Shed Show and said man, I'd like to talk to you for a little bit. I said sure. I said let's chat, man. He said I want to ask you what's the recipe of y'all's success? And he said I want an honest answer. What's the recipe of y'all's success? And he said I want an honest answer. What's the recipe of y'all success? And he said if I'm overstepping? I said no, dude, you're not overstepping at all. I said there's three things. And I said I want you to listen close. I said it's our people, it's our people, it's our people. And he's like oh, and he nudged me.
Shannon:Right.
Darren:And he said I knew you wouldn't tell me and I can honestly tell you, Shannon, as he turned and we've talked a little longer, but as he turned and walked away, my heart was actually sad. He didn't realize I'd told him the whole truth. Yeah. It's 100% our people.
Shannon:I heard somebody say one time our people are our competitive advantage Absolutely. I think that's one of the most brilliant. I told you before we got on air here. I follow Simon Sinek. To me he's just a modern-day marvel in business. I love the way his mind thinks Find your why is a life-changing book for me. He's just a modern day marvel in business. I love the way his mind thinks and uh, you know, find your why is a life changing book for me. So are starting with why, or uh, that's the whole point is to find your why. Why do I do what I do? Not how I do it, not what I do. Why am I getting up every day? What's driving me and my driving force, force behind what, what I do? And he says a hundred percent of businesses are by people, for people. So, if you don't know people, you don't know business. I think sometimes we get it the other way around. We get caught up in it's just business, but it's just business is people.
Darren:Yeah, and I think we get caught up sometimes and you know, that's one thing, that by being on here that I would want to drive home. I feel so lucky, I feel so blessed, as I've already said, but nobody's business goes without problems, man. Everybody's got their sets of problems. But you know what makes problems a lot better when you've got the right people to handle those problems and you've got the right team. That if there's something that I ever I would think that I, if you ask me what I preach around here, so to speak, it would be let's leave our egos out the door, let's be careful to disagree.
Darren:It's not popular, is it?
Shannon:Yeah, well.
Darren:It's not. But let's be careful to disagree. And if I had other folks in here they'd be laughing about that, because we get in this conference room sometime and we literally do. We agree to disagree. Yeah, because, guess what, I only want one thing and they only want one thing, and that's what's right. Yeah, that's truly from my heart. I mean I want what's right and I feel like the team wants what's right. And that's when you know you've got the right people in place. And sometimes we really do. I mean we get kind of heated.
Darren:Trevor got tickled the other day because he said he asked me something and I said, Trevor, if you will hush a minute, I'll tell you what. You know what I'm saying, like that, and he was like he just started dying, laughing. Never, in a disrespectful way, are we yelling, shut up to one another, raising our voices, nothing like that. I'm talking about agree to disagree and you wouldn't believe the times I come into a meeting that I say you know what? This is the direction, we're going on something, and somebody at the end of the table will stick their hand up and say hang on a minute. But have you considered this? And I'm like I'm wrong, guys, we've got to go a different direction. So, I think that's the important thing is truly be about what, honestly, is best for the company. You know the company writes my paycheck, it writes everybody in this building's paycheck, and we have to protect that vehicle if you will. And you know, I also believe that high tide should raise all ships.
Darren:Absolutely and at the end of the day I say this with full honesty. I don't want to make all the money, man. I want other people to be able to, as the ship rises, other people to do better too. There's a limit. You can't give all your profits away or guess what? You're going to have a rough year and you're going to be out of business. But at the end of the day, as we can, I want each employee, each manager, each person to be able to do better and better. What's the glory in making all the money and seeing no one else's life be better around you? That's a pretty sad lie, it's pretty empty.
Shannon:Somebody asked me even some people who've advertised with me said you, you let us do this on your platform or you let your competitors advertise? What if they get business? I said, my goodness, what if they gave me all their business tomorrow? We couldn't handle it anyway absolutely I mean there's a reason why other people are involved.
Darren:I can't, I can't, I would, I would. Wisdom calls to not share numbers, obviously, but right going back to the conversation about attitudes in the industry, changing attitudes in the industry, I said it's my belief we don't stand up on everyone's neck, and we try to help others succeed. I can't tell you how many times we have doubled and doubled and doubled down on growth and at the end of the day, there's times you're going to come up, and you'll feel like that you've put in and you've been taken advantage of.
Darren:But for the most part people truly do appreciate when you try to help them.
Darren:And yeah, there's going to be folks that feel, like you know, that they're taken advantage of, maybe a little bit. Maybe a dealer leaves them and comes to us. Maybe a dealer leaves us and comes to us. Maybe a dealer leaves us goes to them, I think. Where I try to find myself, Shannon, if I'm being honest with you, uh is I'm this ain't words. If I lose a dealer to you, I'm gonna buy you a steak tomorrow. We're gonna sit down, talk about hey, hope he does you a good job. You know I'm saying yeah, I'm not gonna be mad at you.
Shannon:It's what I love about management of so many of these companies. What you're talking about is what I I'm trying to. I'm trying to drive this home, the point you're making to the dealers. I think y'all need to understand these managers and owners and directors. Whatever the titles are these companies, it's always the same they wish you well. They wish you well there. They'll wish you well in your, in your absence. I've never heard not one company talk bad about a dealer. Yeah, I've heard several dealers talk bad about a company and I say, hey, I think it's a perspective it is, I think it's.
Shannon:You got to change your mindset. I think the I was coming up in the elevator, and I heard a saying one time that said people don't do things to you, they do things for themselves. Yeah, that'll change your mindset because it allows you to offer a little grace, to say hey, they're not doing this to you. People are concerned about their well-being, their family, you know they're.
Darren:Well, and sometimes there are things in business that has to be done and sometimes they don't feel good. Guess what I get to do things sometimes that I don't even like doing sometimes. Because sometimes change has to be made, or this has to be done or whatever, but it never.
Darren:the rule I always have is, we had to make a little change here this week on some not here in the office but outside the office and when I went and sat down with some of the group that I had to talk to after that, I said there's one thing that will not be done we will not speak ill will of that individual, we will not put them down.
Shannon:change had to be made but at the end of the day that person is still a good person and I really do mean that that person is still a good person and I count that person a friend I respect you and others for doing that so much, so much, because it you don't, you don't have to, you could get in the dirt and you could get in the grime and and watching so many people not do that is more impressive to me than buying into the dirt and the grime, because that's just the gossip, that's just the ugliness of it.
Darren:And look, hey look, when you boil it down, though a lot of times, sorry to cut you off but when you boil it down. Every time I ever look at it, you actually have two good people. Nearly every time you've got two good people with a difference, why? Why drive a wedge? Why not? Why not?
Shannon:You know what? Have a wedge? Why not? Why not? You know, I'm saying it's, it's just not worth it. If you can take the moral high ground, uh, always try to take the moral high ground. I've attempted to do that. I've also failed at that. I mean, you talked earlier about, you know, uh, discipleship. You know judas's kiss. I've been there, I've been, I would like to say I've been judas's kiss. What did Paul say is the chiefest of sinners. Yeah, yeah and look at that platform. I've been there.
Darren:And I think you have to. I got a call some time ago and somebody brought up hey man, somebody really feels bad at you in the industry because of dealers that have come to you. And I'm like listen, I'm not out trying to push that, but we are competitors and at the end of the day, our people are going here. Sometimes someone feels like they need to go over here, go over there. We can't afford to let there be hard feelings. Come between us. We've been, I've been friends with tons of people in the industry and I'm just I'm telling you where I am. I don't want to have people. I believe that a good name is rather to be chosen than great riches. By the same token, I've had myself fooled for many years too, Shannon. I thought I could walk through this thing, and nobody ever be ill with me or mad at me. I've come to realize that there's sometimes I can't accomplish that maybe, but I tell you what I can control. I can control.
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Darren:And I learned a valuable lesson. I'll tell a little story. When my brother was murdered in 2008, I was telling my mom this story yesterday. My mom, actually a week ago, got diagnosed with breast cancer, and so me and her was at the doctor yesterday and I told her we were sitting in the truck. It was a little bit early, and I told her. I told her we were sitting in the truck, it was a little bit early. I told her. I said you know Mom.
Darren:I said I experienced a hate that was beyond a hate of anything I'd ever felt in my life.
Darren:When my brother got murdered, the guy that did it, I said but I can't tell you the day and I can't tell you the year, but I said I woke up one day, and I was thinking about it and I hated Kenneth Jones and it dawned on me that fast. The hate that's in you is worse than what the man done to your brother, shooting him five times, killing him and I remember my heart just being like, wow, what it was like. It was almost in my mind repeated. The hate that's in you is worse than what happened to the man done to your brother and I can honestly tell you and I told my mom this year by the time I started forgiving, but then they let him out of prison. So, there was that whole thing of dealing with it again. After about five years he got out and stayed out, but by the time the man had a heart attack and passed away at home. I could have went and sat down, had a conversation and took him something to eat.
Darren:You have to get beyond your own stuff. Sometimes it's not easy, dude. I'm definitely not saying that, trying to pin a rose on myself, or act like in any perfect way. He's been around me. Dude, I make more mistakes than anybody else. That's Caitlin. You'll hear me say that all the time. I make more mistakes than anybody in this building. But at the end of the day going back to working every single day on yourself and what we were and want to go, just get it right, what's right.
Shannon:And you've blown my mind here today with a couple of things that I'm experiencing you know personally, even this past week of craziness just hearing God talk to you on different things, and I want you just to show you this isn't made up on my phone. I take these little screenshots all the time.
Darren:I've got them all over my memes, all over my phone. It's terrible.
Shannon:I don't even know if I go back and look at them, but I save them. I do sometimes.
Darren:But you know what, most of the time when I screenshot mine or I put something out, I think it's human. I'm not the guy that's really going to tell you much of what I've got going on. To be honest with you, I'm not going to sit and have a lot of conversations about maybe. I'm just not that guy.
Darren:I'm not going to talk a whole lot about it, but my way of getting when I feel on the bottom, sometimes my way of getting beyond those things. I did share this with Chad Burnett, our president of sales, on the plane this morning, Monday morning, I said you know, Chad, usually the way when I deal, when I'm going through something that I deal, is if I can start trying to throw out seeds of encouragement to other people the whole time I feel like I'm dragging bottom Guess what.
Darren:Most of the time, that's what helps pull me back up where I need to be, and so that's kind of when, I find myself saving memes.
Shannon:Sometimes I might be dealing with something well in the bible owner, I feel like I'm dragging bottom you know. The bible says the, the lord draws near the brokenhearted yeah I used to tell people if you're not brokenhearted, then get near a brokenhearted person yeah because it'll change your perspective on what you're here for and what you're supposed to do, and this is what this is.
Shannon:Mimicking your words, it says uh, it is a choice. No matter how frustrating or boring or constraining or painful or oppressive our experience, we can always choose how we respond dude.
Darren:That's. That's great. That's crazy, because what I told Chad on the plane Monday I said I am convinced again there was a situation that the conversation was about. I said I felt a little differently the other day, but I said I've pondered on it over the weekend and thought about it and it dawned on me the reason this person is reacting in such a negative or maybe an ugly way. I said, until a person has completely hit the bottom, they truly don't know how to have compassion, and they truly don't know how to act.
Darren:Now what's bottom, what's bottom.
Shannon:I don't know. It seems to be ever growing for me Every time I think I find it.
Darren:I can tell you what bottom is for me every time I think I find it. I can tell you what bottom is for me, and bottom is for me. Bottom is when everything's been stripped from you, the news has came and you can do nothing for yourself. There's nothing in the world. Nobody can do anything for you. All odds are stacked against you. You've been promised, basically death from a diagnosis or something. That's bottom bottoms, when you can't help yourself. No matter what you do, I can't fix it, I can't make it difference, I can't change my circumstance. I'm at the bottom yeah, yeah. I need something bigger.
Darren:What's that I need?
Shannon:something bigger than me, yeah.
Darren:Then all of a sudden you begin to realize that guess what? There's more to life than just a little problem. And so, I think when we realize that you alluded to something while I go along the same lines, then you can almost turn. It sounds crazy, but you can almost turn and start having compassion a little bit on the people that maybe want to black your eye a little bit.
Darren:You can realize we are arguing over something that is so frivolous something that is so crazy, but I think at some time it takes us getting at the bottom to understand it's a good word a lot of this.
Shannon:Stuff does not really matter at the end of the day I think that's why the conversation, even like the things you were saying earlier, you know the word argument has such a negative connotation, yeah, but you know the bible talks about the testing of your faith. Yeah, you know, creates that perseverance and like we're not called to an easy life, we're not called to a problem-free life, I told my buddy yesterday I could just see the stress on his eyes you, I mean, you pick up on body language and different things and I said so. You know, I heard this saying once and I don't know if it makes sense to you, but, um, I heard there's no such thing as a problem there. There's just the next thing to figure out.
Darren:Yeah.
Shannon:And I think, if you will take the I mean John Maxwell and so many others talk about problems as opportunities. I think they really are.
Darren:Dude, I couldn't agree with that more. Actually, that's something that I feel like a lot of time if you're having a problem. This is only my experience. I'm definitely not trying to sound preachy-fider.
Darren:I got it all figured out because I don't.
Darren:But a lot of time I find out if I've got a problem and it becomes a problem. That's where I've kind of hit the wall. It feels like a lot of time. It's a good stop and a good reset for actually figuring out a better way of something. Maybe we were trying to go a direction with the company. Maybe we were trying to go a direction and we feel like we've kind of hit and we're spinning our wheels A lot of times. It's a good time to just back up. It's a problem, it's a real problem, but it's kind of back up and you realize, oh, this is actually where we should have been going with this all the way along.
Shannon:Without that problem, you wouldn't have came to that conclusion. You needed that, that fork in the road to send you down. That and, uh, our, our initial, I think, just our humanity, the human experience is to be complaining, and you know as soon as something comes. Ah, yeah this again, or this new thing or this, whatever. It's amazing that we don't look at, because no one wants to go through anything difficult. No.
Shannon:But I just think it's naivety to imagine this utopian world that you exist in that has no problems and all things are good all the time. The people that you see every day with the smiles on their faces Darren like that's intentional. Yeah, because life's beating them up the same way.
Darren:It's beating up everybody else it usually is, I mean. But I think it's all in how we approach things. I mean, I didn't know this talk was going to go this direction at all, but it's kind of in line of what I've been talking about a lot. You know you look at things, you know with mom's diagnosis, and you know there's very good prognosis there. So, it's not like I'm overly.
Shannon:It's come a long way. Yeah, it's not like I'm overly bogged down with it right now.
Darren:But talking about that, I told somebody I said you know the places that I've grown the most in my life. I'm going to compare them to real life. Stuff was what we call the valley of life, and in the valley of life is some of the most beautiful things. You hear it said. The flowers grow in the valley, the streams are in the valley, a lot of your you know what I'm saying some of the most beautiful you get at the mountaintop of life. If you've ever seen a real tall mountain, nothing grows there, nothing as ugly as everything. Oh, it's a great view. You know what I'm saying. But you tend to forget I know I'm speaking for myself. When life is going so good, so fast there's hardly no problems, everything I find myself forgetting the most important things of God family, friends you know what I'm saying all the different things. So, I think it's those times that we find ourselves and that's really where our roots grow, man.
Shannon:I really do. If you wouldn't eavesdrop it on my earlier conversation, then I'm just amazed at the way God's sense of humor works.
Darren:Well, you know, we do have a little accent. No, not really.
Shannon:There's little mics hidden everywhere. That's right. I'm curious Tell me what's next. I want to get to Storm War, or what's next for the industry as a whole if you're 25 years into this thing now, or whatever you, you directly and indirectly, yeah, yes, in other words with you know, with the better built days sure the storm war days, and so on well, even in 2017, what you guys started and seeing, seeing the difference in the last eight years and like where's the industry going?
Shannon:What is? What is I mean? You're? You're a well-thought individual. People would look to your company and say you know, come up to you at the shed expo and ask you questions like hey, what's your secret, right? Well, without giving away your, uh, your secret sauce or whatever, what's?
Darren:I'm a pretty open book man.
Shannon:You know, where do you see the industry going? People would be curious about your thoughts.
Darren:I see it, my personal opinion I see it really, really thriving. Over the next little while I'm not going to get off into every single thing that obviously that we're working on A lot of the stuff people's already seeing. One thing I would probably encourage is that you're going to see us working on additional products beyond just sheds. Maybe see us become a little more into outdoor products. But one of the main things that I would say is technology, I think, is fixing to really creep in.
Darren:Yeah, and it's already creeping in in a good way when I say creeping in, it's not really creeping in fast enough, if I'm being honest with you.
Darren:It needs to creep in a little faster. But I think you're going to really see that we would be hyper-focused on not to say too much here, but we're really hyper-focused on. I don't know where we would be without our online sales. Now, it's each person's opinion on where they want to go with that. I'm not big on online sales in-house to compete with our dealers. I think that's sometimes we know things because we live things right. Yeah, we unintentionally, a few years ago, opened up an online department in-house because it was our belief that the dealers were catching that road traffic, that different customer, and we could create an online platform and build it out and create and capture all these online leads and set and sell them here in the office and was catching a whole different customer than what our dealer was. Yeah, makes sense.
Darren:That was a big belief. I'm not telling you that's not the case, but for us, would you say, that's not really been the case. What we found was and I'll just kind of throw some rough numbers out when we found out, it started kind of roughing the feathers of some of the dealers, and I think we always are to be attentive to what people are saying around us. Sometimes people feel like you're not being attentive.
Darren:I don't care if it's a dealer, a shop, a driver, but sometimes they don't realize what all you're dealing with too. My desire, my harsh desire, is to always be attentive to what people are maybe saying hey, this is a pain point for us. We don't feel like you're understanding where we're coming from. So, I never want to lose my sensitivity to that. Yeah, but what we found was some of the dealers were like hey, it's kind of feeling like you guys are starting to compete with us.
Darren:They were talking to the reps. So the reps would come back and say, hey, you know,
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Darren:So, what we did, we actually took and totally undone our online platforms, so to speak, in-house, and we said we're going to take those same people, we're going to open up, still create all those leads that come in, and we figured out pretty sophisticated ways to track all this stuff. And but what we did in 20, December 21, I think it was December of 21,. We said we're just fixing to do away with online sales in-house and we're going to take those online leads and we're going to send those out to dealers. And so that's what we did, and I think it was I forget the number, actually it was but it was very positive for us.
Shannon:yeah, you saw, you saw an increase through the, through the development of believing in your, in your people absolutely uh and, and you know the, the people help get you there right, like you see that dealer and it's not.
Shannon:It's not as though that dealer network is dead. I you know, I really want the dealers to hear me on that message. It's by no means dead and we're just in this transition period, I feel like, where the brick-and-mortar storefront and the digital storefront are both necessary and I don't know that you can rely on all of one and none of the other. You can't, but it has been for so long, and then that change is hard, but it has been for so long, and then that change is hard. But you do understand that your consumerism as an individual, not as a shed dealer, your consumerism as an individual drives the ideas that companies, the data set they pull from to make these decisions.
Darren:I think we're think we're fixing to have a a hard time for the dealers, the brick and mortars as we've known them. I think we're going to have a really hard time um keeping them healthy and keeping them in business If we don't uh support them in the ways I was talking about with online.
Darren:Yeah, I can tell you this not to get too into. Yeah, sure, sure.
Darren:It increased from January to February. By changing our model, increased our sales one million in one month.
Darren:Yeah, that's amazing. So, you know, and it's grew, continued to grow. That's been back then. It's continued to grow just leaps and bounds, every single, every single year, and I think that's where you're seeing the industry go a whole lot. I, I, uh, I think that's going to be the way to keeping our dealers healthy, keeping them in business guys, we got a lot of competition out here, right? And I'm not complaining about competition because, guess what? There was people in it long before I came along. So why would I be the one complaining about competition? Because, guess what? There was people in it long before I came along. So why would I be the one complaining about competition? As a matter of fact, if you hang around here much, you're going to hear me say I love competition, it completely. And I know we said before we went on air competition is at the bottom, collaboration is at the top.
Darren:But we're still competition, we're still competing for that hey, it keeps us honest it keeps us honest it keeps us sharp and I will say this going back to the online stuff, going back to the different products that we're getting into, uh, you know, it's no secret, you know we do some metal roll forming some more vertical integration type stuff. That is kind of teeing up us to get into multiple products, because we want to be able to deliver multiple products that we manufacture to our core dealers and then turn around and allow them to be able to, you know, with our sister company Heartland you know, what I'm saying being offering up a rent to own, and I think finance is becoming a big thing.
Shannon:I think it's got a ways to go, but it's on the radar just because people are. At the end of the day, no matter what the things are that come up, they are serving the customer and there are new ideas and thoughts and really we're not too far off, Darren, from this is like I love that you're saying the things you're saying because, like these are things that other industries are already diving into perfecting. We don't get to be agnostic because we choose to be in the shed. Industry like. No, all of consumerism won't affect us. What will happen is those who, um, have the opportunities to invest into these things will begin to take market share, because, I mean, that sounds like a sales pitch. So I'm careful on how am I selling or am I just telling the truth? Um, I've said this and I this is. I'm gonna take a bold, bold place here. Uh, I said man, the little guys, if you want to call them the little guys, the uh, the smaller manufacturers that are attempting to. They're hitting those levels right.
Shannon:80-something percent of companies hit a brick wall at 3 million and then at 10 million, and then those numbers begin to escalate as you go farther. There's never been a better opportunity, with the online marketplace, for the smaller company to make the biggest dents.
Darren:Absolutely.
Shannon:Compared to like your big five, your big ten, your whatever you know. And it's a travesty. It's a travesty to say I can just throw something out front and be just fine. I'm not saying you can't.
Darren:What I'm saying is I'm saying you're going to live a hard life. That's what I'm saying, that's what we're seeing. I mean you're going to live a hard life. That's what I'm saying, that's what we're seeing. I mean you really are. You know it's. I said this when we went on. It's ever-evolving. You know it's ever-changing.
Shannon:Well, maybe you don't know it.
Darren:I personally like that. It's been a lot of man. I can't even continue on without saying again it's our people. Yeah.
Darren:But our people have rallied together and been like, oh look, let's open up a dealer support, let's open up all these different departments that we've been able to create. You know, all the way down to working on logistics stuff right now. We'll never You've got to be so careful when you say something, because if you talk about logistics, all of a sudden people are going to be like, oh, they're getting in their own logistics. No, we will never deliver our own sheds. It's a train wreck, it's an aster, it's not going to work. But I'm talking about ways to help assist the drivers, to be able to make sure that that quality, that customer service and that communication is something. Those are three things that I kind of horses that I ride all the time.
Darren:I say this a lot three of the easiest words to say, three of the hardest words to live up to. We will never be a price point business. We will never be trying to be the cheapest out there. That's a race to the bottom in our opinion.
Darren:As a matter of fact, the ones that are price point driven are the ones that people share with me. Well, did you hear about so-and-so? You know what I'm saying? They're having problems and blah blah. It's a race to the bottom. We need to quit that. As an industry, we need to forget about that. We need to put in these People are going to buy these buildings from Stor-M or anyone else.
Shannon:That's in the business. If we have a great product, we have a great, and why would you want to? Why would you want less of a product? No, no customer has ever came to a shed lot said, um, they always say I would like less price. Yeah, but no one's ever said could you take some quality out of that building?
Darren:yeah, no, I agree it'll never happen. They'll never say I want less of a building, and it seems like to me what tickles me about it, and I say this in a lighthearted way. It seems like to me that we've kind of had the mentality if we all sell these things cheap enough, we're going to get so-and-so out of business and so we're going to push the next guy out of business.
Shannon:You're flying a Cessna, not a 747,. If you're thinking like that, if I could, encourage the industry.
Darren:For lack of better words, it would be you know, let's make money. Yeah, let's compete. Yeah, let's be friends. Yeah, let's do things the right way. You know, and if I can, I say this a guy told me the other day they so-and-so don't like you at all and I said you know what, if so-and-so called today, I'd get on a plane and go to California and help him. Anyway, I could.
Darren:That's not a sales pitch, that's a fact, because I want that type of relationship through the industry. I think it's a healthy relationship. There's plenty of sheds to go around.
Shannon:So why sit around Again? If everybody who wanted to buy a shed tomorrow came to you guys, your lead times would go through the roof. It's impossible to do all of it. It's impossible to rent on everything, it's impossible to market everything. There is a reason why other people are in the business together, and I guess the question is it comes down to what kind of world are you trying to create. Are you trying to create a world that's better or worse? And competing does not mean that you're making the world worse.
Darren:I will tell you what we're doing as an industry that does bother me some, and who gives a big whoopity-doo? That it bothers Darren, right, because I understand that, trust me, you understand it very well. But for our own goods, uh, as we compete, we're creating a real place for fraud yes, we are doing things like little to no money down. Uh, we're doing things that are somewhat foolish. That is creating a space for the less than honest people to thrive.
Darren:And man, I can say this because there's not a builder out there that's going to hear this. That's going to be like, well, we haven't dealt with anything. If you're not, you better dive into your business, buddy, because you're not looking at it. There is a lot of different, and as technology grows, it's kind of like the evil comes with it. So as technology grows, I mean, one of the things that we've seen is they go on our e-commerce and they actually screenshot and have this building sold.
Shannon:Organized. Yeah, it's an organized.
Darren:So, I would say for the rent-to-own companies, the manufacturers, there's a bigger problem than John Doe, the competitor down the road. We've got more serious things to worry about, and that's what I'm seeing is a lot of fraud enter our industry that we all should be concerned about. What I find really funny about that and when I say funny I don't know if there's anything funny about it, but we've recently hired a gentleman that's been with us about 90 days and I'm pretty big on him. Gentleman. He's been with us about 90 days, I'm pretty big on him. He came from the sports world. When I say the sports, like I guess you would say four-wheelers, side-by-sides, all that stuff.
Darren:He shared with me that eight years ago the same fraud we're seeing today the fake IDs all this stuff hit that industry eight to ten years ago, to the point it wrecked their world.
Darren:I think that goes to show you how much our industry lags. And as we implement this new stuff, these new e-commerces, all the different ways of online sales it's good stuff. I think it's the way of the future. We just have to rethink and be smart about how we're doing it, because everybody I talk to is seeing a lot of problem with fraud, and I only bring that up because, hey man, I really do mean this. I care about our industry. I just told you a while ago I enjoy competing. I don't want to see anybody not do well in it and uh, it's. It's a real problem of stuff we're dealing with now I agree 100 um gosh.
Shannon:You know, I could start not name dropping, but maybe I could name drop some states, you know I mean what I'm hearing about in South Carolina. You know some stuff in Kentucky. Yeah, you know there's some other places.
Darren:Oklahoma, Mississippi, Alabama. I know a rather large company that's well-known that's been hitting South Alabama really large.
Shannon:It just stinks because, like the truth is, if you're of any moral fiber, like I can't think of any one time where I was like, well, I'm glad they got hurt, I'm glad they got hit. That is not a rising tide lifts all boats, matter of fact, that's the opposite. Uh, we're only as strong as our weakest link and I'm not calling them weak for that, I'm saying that can happen to anybody. But I agree with you, you know we need to be able to organize enough to. You know, I've been saying for some time now I love that we have the NSRA and I love that we have these organizations that come up to try and help educate and even prevent things. I mean just even a trade organization surrounded the shed industry where we can communicate better on high-level things that don't even really matter about competition.
Darren:Now I think you've been hacking me Because I've been saying the same thing Like all right guys. I've actually called you know competition. I've been calling a lot of folks lately and been like hey what do you think about us creating a board?
Darren:A board of directors, an RTO board of directors, let's put some things in place. You know what I'm saying board of directors and rto board of directors, let's, let's put some things in place. You know, I'm saying obviously you've got your laws, we've, you know, thankful to have in-house counsel and things. So, we can't be price fixing, we can't be doing all that stuff. Yeah, but how do we, how do we as an industry sit down and say, okay, I don't care that we compete, right, let's put something in place that protects us all even a manufacturing board, a group of manufacturers that come together to say you know, how do we better things?
Shannon:uh, think about the other stuff that could come out of that. Darren like uh, you know, I'm thinking way long term and I'm probably getting to the. You know, literally the cart before the horse, but I'm thinking about scholarship opportunities for those who want to get into trades. Hey, college degrees ain't as hot as they used to be, right, there's a lot of students that are getting back into the trades.
Darren:I wish I had a better education, but I tell my children listen, get a trade man, get a trade. There's so many people that's got a great college education that's looking for jobs today.
Shannon:And that would benefit R&D. That would benefit you know. I'm so happy that you talked about product development and things that you guys are doing. Uh, even though you briefly touched on it, because I mean we could get very simple, we could, we could funnel this down to. We all build a box.
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Shannon:I'll build a box to put stuff in. I don't think.
Darren:You know one of the leaders in the industry many years ago and I'm kind of hesitant to use names because I don't know if anybody wants their name on here.
Shannon:I always use them in a positive manner.
Darren:It's a positive manner is what we're saying. But I asked them. I said do you think we'll be building sheds 20 years from now? And the gentleman said, absolutely, we'll be building sheds 20 years from now. And the gentleman said, absolutely, we'll be building sheds 20 years from now. But I think there will be a lot more options on the table. I think there will be a lot more stuff. That's what we're seeing. We're seeing there's a lot more options on the table.
Shannon:Man. The industry's slow though Darren it is, they're slow to change.
Darren:Well, the reason is I can agree with some of the folks that want to build a simple box.
Darren:That's the easiest way to mass produce this stuff and that's where we get into a lot of little to no money, down very cheap pricing and things like that is we're not offering enough line, that what we're struggling to keep the amount of building sales that we need. So, you know, but our industry lends itself. I told somebody this the other day. I said there is several billion dollars worth of business that I believe I can tap into as Stor-M or and I don't think there's no I's in this industry, but we can tap into without worrying about going down the road of what we were just talking about. You know, less price. I mean, there's a huge built-on-site industry. Yeah.
Darren:There's finished-out cabins industry. There is so much industry that we're not even plugged into yet. Man, that's what gives me faith and hope that there is many, many years of longevity in the shed business, and I'm talking major longevity in the shed business. And I'm talking major longevity in the shed business. And where do they?
Shannon:blend. You talked about row forming. Like I'm going to one of the trade shows. It's a row forming show. True, In October, I don't know. I think it's a week after the expo and the one thing I'm finding, especially as manufacturers start to get larger, is that's a common thing. They're like, wait a minute. They're getting more vertically integrated and they're starting to look at how can I maybe control my inventory flow a little bit better? I'm making my own doors or doing my own thing? I?
Darren:think COVID caused a lot of that too.
Shannon:Because of supply shortage.
Darren:Yeah, absolutely, I mean, and there's no rock thrown toward any vendor, anybody. Covid was rough on us all. If you didn't learn something valuable during COVID, then I don't know you know really what to say. But yeah, covid, I think, caused a lot of people's minds to go that direction, because supply you know, was a real issue and everybody's like, hey, I don't want to get caught there again.
Darren:So, I know that had some bearing on us. But with us I think it's more uh, if you get into row forming and building more parts and pieces, it allows us the opportunity to get into other industries. There's a huge world of carport industry. There's a huge world of post frame industry. There's a huge world of all these different things that you know. I'm saying that I'm not going into great detail, but people are already seeing it. I'm not trying to hide it from anybody. I've been pretty open. People that sit down one-on-one with me. I usually say, hey, yeah, listen, man, I'm getting into this because I plan on, God willing, I plan on being in this and this and this and the next and the next. You know what I'm saying, so I don't matter of fact.
Darren:I think me sitting on this podcast trying to downplay it. It's the natural thing to do, because there is a certain side of you that says, well, I just don't want to vomit my business everywhere right. But it's also a lot of opportunity. So maybe somebody listening to this wants to sit down and have a conversation about hey, how do we get in the post-frame business together? You know we've opened up our first operating partner.
Darren:Most people know the way that a lot of our shops are opened up. We've opened up our first operating partner with the post-frame business and we continue I always say this, God willing we continue to try to build on that, you know. I suspect we would be in the carport business in some time as we grow some of this stuff out. We just don't want to grow into it to the point that we're not capable to compete, which means we have to own that roll forming.
Darren:We have to be able to build those parts and pieces in order to get where we're wanting to go Well.
Shannon:Vertical integration a lot of time is key, but there's so many companies out here, manufacturers. You know, I just said recently, you know, a fellow in Michigan was telling me he had a shed out back and I said what size? And he said like an 80 by 120. And I was like man, that's not a shed, because we think mini barns or sheds or portable or all these different things. The reality is, you know that shed, that common denominator, that word shed, uh, it fits so much into so many categories and we're starting to see that bleed over from one industry into the next and we call it an industry, but the reality is it's soaking up to one industry. Sure, outdoor products, backdoor product? I don't know. That's why absolutely.
Darren:I mean, you know, we, we are owned by Stormore Outdoor Products. Yeah. And that's the company that we own, that's our parent company and, truthfully, Shannon, you'll probably see a lot of branding of that come about in the next little while that's awesome.
Darren:And Stor-Mor Outdoor Products owns Stor-Mor and the other entities that we own. But that's kind of the goal and I think if we as an industry, if we think a little more outside the box, I think we get away from the things. In some ways we become our own worst enemy, and that is we feel like there's only one product line and we've got to compete and we need a certain amount of sales to pay the bills. We need a certain amount of sales to pay the bills.
Shannon:we need a certain amount of sales to pay the all the employees I mean even talking about like the like, that post frame world and all of that. Um, you know it's hard to know where it bleeds over, but you guys are leaders in this and that's why you're, that's why you're gonna lead in the ideas. Uh, I stopped by your shop on 45 here and I was like, man, it's just awesome, just love to see what they do. I told you before I love, uh, meeting with your dealers. Um, they're always highly organized. Uh, there's just a, I don't know I'm gonna, I'm gonna maybe get off on a rabbit trail here a little bit, but you know, when you go to all the Amicos or you go to all the Sitgos and I'm sorry I'm name-dropping you guys out- here.
Darren:You're welcome on the podcast here as soon as you want to be on there, right? Yeah, that's right, you're welcome on the podcast, come on. Come on and talk to me.
Shannon:Yeah, that's right, yeah, but you know there's something different about going to Bucky's Sure, or something different about going to John Deere, something different about Harley Davidson. You know there's something different about Apple. I mean, I use these all the time as an example of that consistency, that brand that they put out, and I see that with store-bought.
Darren:Yeah, man, I mean this from the most. That means more to me than anything you could. I appreciate that that's our goal. We want to be different. I don't want to.
Darren:You know there's I say this a lot there's only so many things you can do to a shed. You know what I'm saying. So how do we become different? And I think what we have to do is we have to think outside the box a little bit. We have to look at, okay, you know, there's only about one company out there that's hyper-focused on built-on sites and when you think about this, you know who they are state, region or not. In all the multiple uh, in all the big cities, metropolitan areas, there's so many customers in there that we can't even service right now. So, we have to rethink things right. Yes, yeah, from the post thing, post frame world, the carport world, we, the carport world's a wonderful industry. It's been. It's been run in a way I probably wouldn't have run it. That don't mean I'm right and they're wrong or they're right and I'm wrong, but we have tended to forget that quality and customer service and all that type of stuff needs to go hand-to-hand with that industry.
Darren:If you look at the reviews in the carport industry, it's pretty staggering. So, I think those are ways that we become different and making sure that our products are a quality product, not just that we're building, I'm talking about what we're putting in our products and then your customer service thereafter because the sales after the service is really just as important as the sale before the service.
Shannon:It almost seems wide open in many ways in that industry for someone to come take. I'm curious about your thoughts on this and we're getting long-winded, but I like the conversation. I'm curious about your thoughts when you think about that online model. I've been preaching this for about six months now. I don't know if I'm right, I'm just opinionating.
Darren:I think I know where you're headed, but I think you're right man.
Shannon:when you look at carports, nobody drags a carport down the road, 100% on-site built. And then when I poll and ask people and try to find data sets, that kind of drive, the answer I'm looking for, like is prefab as important as it once was. I'm not saying gosh, I've been accused of he's trying to get rid of the dealer network, and all I can do is come on here and defend myself constantly and say I promise I'm not by asking questions or creating questions or asking about theory. What I'm saying is like so many companies are telling me we're selling 50, 60, 70% new builds.
Darren:Yeah.
Shannon:And, and. We're dumping all this money into prefab, not saying get rid of your dealer network, saying, do what Darren's talking about and and help your dealer with that online sales model. You just need someone to reciprocate that.
Darren:Yeah, you went a little different direction than where.
Darren:I thought, you was, but I do think you're spot on with that. I'm going to say this I was in a meeting with one of the largest carport companies in the United States a phone meeting the other day, and they explained to me that their sales seemed to be regressing. And we were talking about how the industry is and I said man, I want to tell you something, you've been hijacked. And he said I've been hijacked and this is not going to be popular with the dealers, so you may want to cut this out. Okay, I'm just carrying on. I'm going to tell you my thoughts.
Darren:The carport industry several years ago went in and started allowing anybody and everybody that wanted to to sell online. What that done is the person that's willing to go out and put a carport demo on a dealer. This person will put a carport dealer, a carport company, will put their demos on their lot. Then that dealer will turn around and sell for five different carport companies in one whack.
Darren:That's not going to work. That's very common too. It's very common, but it's not going to work. That's very common too. It's very common, but it's not going to work. Because, at the end of the day, the person that believed in you, dealer, and believed in what you were trying to do, and they put up the money Shannon, not trying to create hard feelings with anyone.
Shannon:They're not seeing the effect. That's not right. Yeah, they're not seeing the.
Darren:So we got to talking about how are we going to fix that Wish I could have been on this phone call.
Shannon:I'm interested in everything you're saying right now.
Darren:So you know, I went into great detail and I don't feel like it's wisdom right now to go into detail, but I went into great detail on how I feel like we're going to have to fix that and part of how we fix.
Darren:That is, I feel like the dealer is doing what they feel they need to do to survive. So how do we join arms with that dealer and bring them product lines to where they're like? I would not leave Shannon's buildings for nothing, because Shannon has me covered here, here, here and here. I think that's where we have to go as an industry and I hope I'm making sense of what I'm saying I think we have to, rather than feel frustration toward the dealer, rather than be ill with the dealer.
Darren:I sat right in this very conference room and told a dealer the other day. He told me he was doing that too in the carport world and I said, brother, I said I'm going to tell you my honest opinion, face to face. I don't think it's ethical. I said you took one man's product and you're selling for multiple people. The only way I can feel that is ethical at all is if you buy that product from that carport company and you own the demos, then sell for who you want to.
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Shannon:But that's my personal opinion.
Shannon:And that's going to be offensive to some dealers hearing me say that, yeah, there's going to be some people not agree.
Darren:They're not agree and that's up to them. But if they were putting the money up for those demos, they would feel the same way.
Shannon:I'll tell you what that brings in a whole big conversation about consignment and wholesale and really how the industry, I said for a long time, and the way it corrects itself, is baseball cards. Yeah, so baseball cards, what are you talking about? Well, I was a big collector of baseball cards and I don't know if you remember, uh, being you're about the same age growing up. You know they were everywhere, there were all kinds of different ones and I had a favorite player and I'd have to get one from every style. And at some point there became some oversight or some collaboration that decided to work together to say let's limit the official right, the official cards that come out to, to create them as more valuable. And my concern was you know, I've definitely seen those dealers. I'm gonna offend some people now. You took your turn, all mine's never to offend somebody.
Darren:Mine's to be honest.
Shannon:Well they know, choose to be offended, right, yes, uh, um, you know, for me it's kind of like well, if you, if you don't have the skin in the game, it's easy to jump from manufacturer to manufacturer to manufacturer. You know, I could probably get on a tidbit I should have earlier about dealer premiums and rto, and, oh boy, we can get in some rabbit trails.
Darren:A hundred percent.
Shannon:I just, you know you talk about races to the bottom and different things, it's who can out-compete with a wallet. But is it good for the industry? It might be good for the individual, maybe you win business, but is it good for because I don't know long-term that even if you want to win all the business that you can and that you can handle it anyway, so that you can and that you can handle it anyway. So, my mindset kind of goes towards you know, if we could create that skin in the game you're talking about, that ethical charge that you're talking about, then it just becomes really about true competition.
Darren:I think that's what you're going to find from us, in full transparency of not getting into all the details, but I think that's what you're going to find from us, with maybe seeing some rebranding of Stormore Outdoor products.
Shannon:Awesome.
Darren:And so, it's trying to get people more invested with us, trying to get people more committed to our goal. You know, you was talking a while ago and I told you I appreciate it more than anything, but you just seem different. Stor-Mor just seems different. I've explained, it's our people, but I think it's also there's a banner here behind us. You know, st Jude Children's Research Hospital.
Darren:Between God and St Jude, I'm here and I've said this multiple times and I won't I will never be involved in a business at all that I'm partnered in, that we do not have a greater cause beyond profits. And I think we have to rethink the whole thing, and that is, yes, we need more products. Yes, we need to think the stuff we've been talking about. You know rent to own, finance online, all that, but for us and the morale of our company. We don't do this for our morale. Yeah, we do this because it's the right thing. And between God and St Jude, I'm here. But there's not a doubt in my mind, Shannon, when we start our fundraising for St Jude and our people come off that elevator on the third floor and there's that little bald-headed child smiling back at you and we don't understand that there's a greater cause than another dollar bill in our bank account, and there's a greater cause than what we're here just to serve ourselves. We need to be serving others.
Darren:So, you know, I think that's some of what helps make us different too is the employees adopt that and they and they live that and they, they believe that that. Guess what? As we make more money, we save more lives. As we save more lives, not just in Kentucky, not just in Tennessee, not just in the United States. We're saving lives around the world. We've got some other things that we're looking into, some boys' and girls' homes, some things that we can do that try to help with some of our newer entities that we've been talking about a little bit today. So, I think, as it all, to me it's about building the morale of the shop, of the driver, of the dealer, of our office, our reps. And how do we do that? We have to be different, we have to be different. We have to be different.
Shannon:Darren, you're lucky I don't sell sheds. I'd be knocking on the door of a Stor-M or tomorrow, brother, I love it. I love what you're saying. It reaches my heart and I'll tell you what I also know. It's true, I see what you guys have done locally. Now People in the industry across the nation won't understand this, but the St Jude's Dream Home giveaway here in western Kentucky that they give away constantly, Stor-Mor got involved with that because of that very belief. So, you're literally living out your testimony in real life and we're seeing it. I believe exactly what you're saying. If there's not something greater than the profit of a dollar, then I feel like we've kind of missed the mark a lot of times.
Shannon:We've missed the point. Man On business Dude. First of all, I'm impressed by the company. I'm just so thankful, more than anything, that guys like yourself and you know, Chris, and just all the partnerships you know there's probably so many people I can't even think of to mention in the moment have given folks like myself to have an opportunity to be here to find some fulfillment in something that you're doing. I landed in the shed industry upside down, right Like I didn't. I didn't grow up.
Darren:A lot of us did. Some of us just still stayed upside down, but you know what I'm saying.
Shannon:But I don't, I didn't talk to you know, always joke and say I didn't talk to my guidance counselor and say, hey, I want to work in the shed industry, and I don't think that's how you get there. But God has a uh, he has a, a unique road that gets us all to where we need to be. I'm thankful for you guys to come on this again. Your dealers have been great, the ones I've had the chance to interview. Thank you guys so much. Your leadership here is truly remarkable, um it truly is, man.
Darren:Uh, we started with this, we'll end with this. It's our people, yeah, from our, from our, from our dealers, to our shops, to our drivers, the folks in the office here, um, you know, our sister company, heartland, with the rent to own all the, all the different pieces, my partner, Chris, uh, Burnett, all the, all the stuff that it takes. I just don't understand, Shannon, and I truly mean this. I just don't understand someone ever getting lifted up or feeling big in their self for what they've been able to obtain. Because when I look around and I understand, we're truly here because of our people and the people that surround this company, and without them we wouldn't have nothing.
Shannon:One of my favorite stories from the shed industry is a fellow I used to go to church with. He was a human resources individual at a company not to be named Good company. I'm not naming them, not because they're not a good company. I company not naming them, not because they're not a good company, I'm just not naming them, you know. And he talked about a paradigm shift and I want to quit here and then we'll pray us out and then we'll go eat or something Like we're hungry, whether we eat together or not, I want to go get something.
Shannon:But he said, speaking of eating, he said this was a situation for him, he said he was human resources and they used to be. You may figure out who this is just based off of this. There used to be a place that would serve up every Thursday, a potato with barbecue on it, and he said you know, we go on Thursdays. And he said all the people were at me because I was running late that day and he's just kind of a guy who's all over the place, right, you know. And he said, young man, come in, humble hat in hand, and was like, sir, I heard you guys might be hiring up here. I was wondering if you could give me a, an opportunity or job. And he's like, yeah, yeah, just uh, you know, fill out the application. Maybe this kid that you know how it is you know, we gotta eat.
Shannon:It's lunchtime. I gotta hurry and can't take the time to be still and. And he's like you know, honk, honk, honk. You know, come on, come on, we're going to eat. You know, getting the car there, I am trying to get him this, trying to get him that, and he's just all over the place. And the guy's like okay, and he starts to fill out the application. He's like well, just fill it out, bring it back, and I'll try to get it to the right people. And the guy says he said I just kept seeing this kid struggle. I just kept seeing him struggle. Could you hurry up and go and come back? And now this guy, this kid's, probably got no opportunity to a job. He hasn't landed here at a good time in the day sure lunchtime busy.
Shannon:I'm in a hurry. Nothing caught me uniquely unusual about this kid with a hat in his hand, other than he came up here looking for a job. And as they kept honking and the situation grew more, whatever he said well, I would, sir. It's just that you know I can't read and I was wondering if you could help me write this application out.
Darren:And he said he said, I sighed real big.
Shannon:And I just told him go on, go eat, just go on. He said instead, I sat there, and I helped him fill the application out and I pulled for him to get that job. I tried everything I could to make sure, and he did. He got the job, but he went from. What an amazing opportunity of a paradigm shift in the middle of the day. I don't know if we're in a paradigm shift in this industry, but I'll tell you what some of the words you spoke here today about what the future looks like are ringing bells in my head for what we see I really want to say this man, you know we've got off in some deeper stuff.
Darren:We've had some you know I'm saying some deeper conversations, some times of trying times and all that, but I really would end this on a very, very positive note, man, and the positive note that I would end it on and it's not for sales pitch at all I think there's more opportunity today in the industry than what it's ever been, but I do think we have to rethink the way we've been approaching things and I think we have to be smarter than what we've been in the past. Throwing buildings on the side of a road with a banner on them is not going to get you very far anymore, I'm afraid. Yeah.
Darren:So I think we've got to be smarter, and that's something we're trying to do. I never want to leave this podcast and leave the idea that we've got it all figured out Right, we know what all's up and all that.
Darren:I don't feel that way. We're learning every day. We've got, we've got, uh, highs and lows, like anyone else, but, uh, I do believe the direction we're trying to go. I wouldn't be going this direction if I didn't feel that way, but I feel like the direction we're trying to go is to give us the longevity in the marketplace and offer the products that are needed, give the dealers more opportunity to have greater sales. You know what I'm saying? All the different things I feel like as an industry, if we rethink these things, yeah, we're going to have a lot of competitors, but I think we're all going to be healthier at the end of the day.
Shannon:Anybody who wants to reach out to you, find out how to become a Stor-Mor dealer, be a Stor-Mor partner in some way. What's the best way for them to go?
Darren:to www. stormor. com and they will be directed from there on, kind of where to put in their information, whether it's a new someone wanting to be a shop, or a dealer, or a driver, or so on. So, yeah, man, thank you so much for allowing us to have a conversation. I hope this is first and foremost. I hope this is helpful to someone. You know what I'm saying. Yeah, and one more time I'll say it, not in a way that we've got it all figured out, but hopefully this can be helpful to people and let them kind of, you know, understand that, hey, maybe we you mentioned a paradigm. You know what I'm saying. Maybe we need to rethink the industry.
Darren:Maybe you know what I'm saying Maybe, maybe we need to rethink the industry, maybe we need to rethink the way we're approaching things, because there's a lot of good people in this industry man. And I love to see people thrive.
Shannon:So, man, it's been really good. Uh, I can't say enough good for you. If you guys are curious about uh finding out more information, just go and click on the email newsletter that we send out for every episode. We'll put a link to link to the website that Darren mentioned. Hope you guys go and run and sign up today. The leadership here is amazing and I think you'll have a great opportunity. They've been nothing but courteous, kind and polite and thoughtful.
Darren:Thank you, very thoughtful. We're just like Jesus we love you all.
Darren:so come on, I love it.
Shannon:I'm going to say a little prayer just to get us out of here, if that's okay.
Shannon:Uh, lord, thank you for this day, this opportunity, uh, just to come together.
Shannon:Uh, your word says the iron sharpens iron, and uh, we believe that those that enjoy listening also hopefully they uh enjoy speaking about their testimony that you've given to them, and Darren's done that here today, with both, um, both the trials and tribulations that exist in life, absent from even business, but also trying to follow your will, even in business. God, never let us get to the point to where the truth sounds like a sales pitch. We're just trying to be honest here, trying to build community and trying to build this industry up to something good where we can serve you ultimately, for your word and your will, and to do the great commission that you ask us to go out and do. Spread your word, spread the gospel. So let our actions reflect that in our daily activities, through our business adventures, through our agreements and disagreements. Uh, I ask that you'd bless all that's listening to this podcast today and that you would uh um to just speak to them where they are today, as you've spoken to me through all these opportunities. I appreciate that.
Shannon:Uh, always in Jesus name, amen amen thanks again,