Shed Geek Podcast
The Shed Geek Podcast offers an in depth analysis of the ever growing and robust Shed Industry. Listeners will experience a variety of guests who identify or specialize in particular niche areas of the Shed Industry. You will be engaged as you hear amateur and professional personalities discuss topics such as: Shed hauling, sales, marketing, Rent to Own, shed history, shed faith, and much more. Host Shannon Latham is a self proclaimed "Shed Geek" who attempts to take you through discussions that are as exciting as the industry itself. Listeners of this podcast include those who play a role directly or indirectly with the Shed Industry itself.
Shed Geek Podcast
Thriving in the Shed Industry: Sales Insights and Innovations with Ben Eichsteadt
Discover the secrets to thriving in the shed industry from an insider's perspective! This episode features Ben Eichsteadt, National Director of Sales for EZ Pay Buildings, who shares his unexpected journey into the world of sheds and sheds light on the industry's impressive growth. Learn how the COVID-19 pandemic spurred innovation and adaptation, transforming sales strategies and driving technological advancements. Ben provides valuable insights into the challenges new dealers face and emphasizes the importance of continuous training to stay competitive in this dynamic market.
Get ready to elevate your sales game with expert advice on perfecting your craft. From mastering the Rent-to-Own (RTO) model to practicing fundamental sales techniques, this episode is packed with actionable tips for enhancing customer relationships and ensuring satisfaction. Ben draws parallels to the dedication of top athletes, underscoring the necessity of practice and continuous improvement in sales.
Join us as we explore the vital role of industry collaboration and effective communication. Ben shares his thoughts on managing customer relationships, particularly in the RTO sector, and offers strategies for maintaining consistency as a business scales. We also discuss the importance of finding your purpose, inspired by Simon Sinek's philosophy, and how understanding your "why" can lead to greater fulfillment in business. Whether you're in the shed industry or just looking for valuable sales insights, this episode is a treasure trove of knowledge and inspiration.
For more information or to know more about the Shed Geek Podcast visit us at our website.
Follow us on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, or YouTube at the handle @shedgeekpodcast.
To be a guest on the Shed Geek Podcast visit our website and fill out the "Contact Us" form.
To suggest show topics or ask questions you want answered email us at info@shedgeek.com.
This episodes Sponsors:
Studio Sponsor: Union Grove Lumber
My Shed
Shed Hub
Digital Shed Builder
iFAB
CAL
Okay, welcome back to another episode of the Shed Geek podcast and so happy to be doing this interview today. Ben, do you just want to sort of introduce yourself a little bit about who you are and what you do, sir.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Sure. My name is Ben Eichsteadt. I am the National Director of Sales for EZ Pay Buildings. I have been in this role. It will be four years this coming up August. It has been quite a ride. In fact, I was not even aware that this was an industry before coming to EZ Pay and I have absolutely loved getting to know our partners and getting to know the industry. We operate in 30 different states. You know we handle a variety of products, the two mains being steel buildings and portable buildings and sheds, and I'm excited to meet you for the first time, Excited to be here.
SHED GEEK:Oh, that's great. I love your comments. I didn't know it was an industry. I've heard other guys say that before. They said I was just in sheds. I didn't know sheds was an industry Like it's. You know, it's we are just we've always done this, and it's really grown up. The industry's really grown up, you know.
BEN EICHSTEADT:I do, yeah, but I say I didn't know it as an industry. I mean, I was never involved in the shed business at all. Right, so that was a completely new thing. But even in my short time here you're 100% right. The industry has grown up quite a bit in a very short period of time. They've gotten so much savvier, you know, not just technology wise, but looking at their businesses and how they run their businesses. And if you can quantify how I can only imagine at one point this industry was kind of each town had a lot and that's where you went to get your building. You go to the next town, you talk to the Sam over there, that's where that town gets his building, and I bet it was that way for a very long time. But once we were sort of forced as an industry to adapt new technologies and adapt new ways, the speed at which they've sort of caught up and continue to grow is really impressive.
SHED GEEK:Yeah, there was a lot of conversation, it seemed like right around COVID or pre-COVID, about a lot of the technology that had sort of hit the industry. And man, what a what an unusual time for it to hit the industry, because COVID sort of forced many people, not just in sheds but just in retail in general, out of their comfort zone. So, did you guys experience the same? It seems like you know we saw sheds that were just, you know, disappearing at such a high rate that sales no longer became the point of topic or conversation, but labor became the topic of conversation. How do I get people, how do I keep them? And is this here to stay?
BEN EICHSTEADT:Yeah, 100%. I started at EZ Pay in August of 2020. So, sort of right in the middle of it, august of 2020. So, sort of right in the middle of it, and the first thing that I was told was we were expecting this to be an industry killer and so, from EZ Pay's perspective, they were all of the other things happening. So, it was.
BEN EICHSTEADT:I mean, just looking at the numbers coming through EZ Pay in the first year and a half that I was there, it seemed to me that as long as you had a building on the lot and an open sign that it was going to go, somebody was going to come and take it right.
BEN EICHSTEADT:And you're right, labor was definitely an issue. Then, of course, the materials became an issue and supply became an issue. But you're right in the sense that it was great to see how the industry responded when they were kind of taken out of their comfort zone and forced to adapt to new ways to go to market. You know, I think it could be said about a lot of us myself. Certainly, sometimes, you know, the only time that I really do any action is when I'm backed against a corner, and I think, from the industry as a whole, they kind of were and they really stepped up to the plate and it just saw just, I mean, a spike in the industry, sort of a launching pad to new levels that it might not see, you know, again for a singular time period event.
SHED GEEK:Do you think new dealers, that sort of hit the industry during that peak? Do you think it's been a surprise of what we've seen post-COVID and what's really the focus now? I mean, you kind of talked about the focus on sales now and sometimes the lack thereof, so let's hop into that conversation a little bit. What's your thoughts on that?
BEN EICHSTEADT:I do speak to different groups about this because I know that we tend to change our focus. Now our conversations are more along the lines of what's our SEO looking like? What are we doing with our ads? How many leads are coming in? But I look at all of these tools and no doubt these are integral and vital parts of running a successful business these days. But at the end of the day, those are tools to help you create a conversation right. They're tools to get somebody to come to your lot or tools to get somebody to pick up the phone, and one of the challenges that I see that's happened is because you didn't have to do much selling in COVID. It just had to have inventory.
BEN EICHSTEADT:A lot of us have sort of lost the craftsmanship of the sales call and breaking down what that is. And then when you extrapolate that to bigger teams, I talk to teams all the time about are we retraining these? Are we over our pitches? You know why does the guy who manages the lot on Tuesday and Wednesday sell 30 buildings a month and the guy who manages it on Monday and Friday only sell 10. A lot of that can come down to what is your conversation like?
BEN EICHSTEADT:And I think that the industry would be I don't know if wise is the best word, but I think that the industry would be. I don't know if wise is the best word, but I think more attention needs to be paid to that aspect, the aspect of actually having the conversation to close the sale. You know, now we're starting to see maybe a slightly corrective year, right, where the numbers aren't what they were in COVID Sale leads are harder to close, sale leads are harder to close, good leads are harder to get. So those conversations now are at the peak of importance, right, because now you've got to do your best to get, as everyone and that comes down to honing your craft and really understanding the conversation and the goals that you want to have within that conversation to close, the sale.
SHED GEEK:I couldn't agree more. You said a couple of words in there that stuck out to me, that really made me think. You know, when I was growing up, if you heard the word craftsmanship, you know you really thought about somebody who, you know, wasn't just crafty but was, was was more of a um, oh, what's the word I'm looking for. They were more of a subject matter expert on a particular thing. They were craftsmen, you know, in terms of like, being a mechanic. They were craftsmen in terms of being a carpenter, but whatever their trade was, and and we, we do have so many different segments to this industry Wholesalers, retailers, manufacturers who distribute through multiple locations or lots on a consignment model, we have shed haulers that are dealers, you know, we have, uh, it's, it's just this wide range. And then, and then I don't even know where it stops now, ben and like one other industry begins, because we do have, like sheds, carports, post frame, I mean, you know, gazebos, play sets, furniture.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Yeah, yeah, I mean, you're right and I don't think that it does, and I call it craftsmanship, sort of. I guess I kind of look at it. I never made the connection from an analogy standpoint until you just sort of mentioned you know carpenters and things. Analogy standpoint until you just sort of mentioned you know carpenters and things. I look at sales and a salesperson and the craft of sales as what I like to call creating a path to purchase.
BEN EICHSTEADT:So whether you are a wholesaler and you are, you know, more on the business to business side, looking for dealers to take on your buildings, or whether you are a customer facing lot and you're selling buildings to customers, whether it's steel or sheds, those conversations that you're having, while they may be different in content, there are some basic building blocks that we really should be paying attention to with them, blocks, right, that we really should be paying attention to with them. And then, of course yes, there's no question, this is a people, industry and relationships arm and everybody's going to have their own sort of special style, their own special sauce. But if you also really understand the fundamentals of a conversation and you kind of do it with the specific goals and the specific areas and the specific confines of that. You're going to have a lot more repeatable success, and that's really all we're trying to get to right. We want a repeatable process that can produce predictable results.
ADVERTISEMENT:Hello from the Shed Geek. Let's take a walk through My Shed 3D. With My Shed 3D, your company can simply add a 3D builder button to its website. Once the customer clicks onto the 3D builder button, they will enter some basic information to get started. Remember this information is captured in your leads tab. Whether or not the customer designs a building, this is very valuable information that turns a cold call into a warm lead. Next, they begin the design of their shed by selecting a primary use, a style and a size that best fits their need.
ADVERTISEMENT:My Shed 3D has multiple styles that are available and consistent with traditional and barn styles within the shed industry. However, if you offer a customized or non-traditional style, My Shed Solutions can build that design for future use. We can also save on some design features that make it easy to adjust without a major rebuild or added fees for design changes. For instance, want to offer a steeper roof pitch? Just navigate to the Settings tab Then click the Building Models. Just navigate to the Settings tab, then click the Building Models, click Edit Building and just enter the new roof center height and the design changes will reflect on this style option. This will save you thousands versus traditional design changes that need to build a whole new style to match your design From here. Simply choose a style, siding and color. Then choose a trim and roofing style and color. Next, let's add a door that was goofy. Next let's add a door. It is required to add a door to move forward with the design, as at least one ingress egress option is necessary. Then add some design changes for personalization, maybe some windows or a porch or some interior shelving. Next, just click save design and the customer will receive an automated text with all the features of the design to the email address entered at the beginning. From here, they can edit the design, view the details of the design, pay now to order the shed or click rent to own to complete the necessary steps to purchase a shed they designed with MyShed3D. The design enters the admin panel as a quote and this is where the manufacturer can update the progress of the design once a deposit is taken.
ADVERTISEMENT:My Shed from design to delivery. We have you covered.
SHED GEEK:I love it.
SHED GEEK:Repeatable process, predictable results. I'm writing that down just because I like that. I want to maybe even come back to that.
SHED GEEK:When you talk about craftsmanship in terms of like the sales trade, what sort of comes to mind for you, ben for like shed selling specifically. I tend to think that there's like some common denominators, that sort of like reach across the aisle for, like all sales. You know, maybe it's your appearance, it's the way you dress, it's the training, it's, you know, having a CRM working the CRM working the leads, the leads. There was a time where you just set shed lots and there's probably still many companies who do this and it's amazing that you can get into this business and do that. I think that was a comment.
SHED GEEK:Going back to what Richard Mashburn said, you can still build some sheds, throw them out on the road and have a legit business in this industry. It's amazing you can still do that. But we've almost graduated past that. Now to where, as you develop into, like these bigger companies, where does training fit into the conversation? You know, a new salesperson comes on, we send them 200 buildings or 100 or 50 or 20. Let's just see what they do. Let's hope they do well. Is that the recipe for success?
BEN EICHSTEADT:or what's your thoughts. No, I think you bring up a really good point. I mean one of the. So, when I look at the sales conversation in general and so from the perspective of the lot manager to the customer, but it applies across the board, right? There's basically five segments of the conversation and a big part of that is you have to be the expert in what you're selling.
BEN EICHSTEADT:There's a lot of times where I hear lot managers say well, I don't know about that or I'm not sure about that, and there are some customers that will come on to the lots and they'll just assume that each building is the same and they're really you know, and they're basically assume that each building is the same and they're really you know, and they're basically looking why is your building more than their building?
BEN EICHSTEADT:It is incumbent on the manufacturer or the sales company to make those lot managers absolute experts in that product, so that when I come to buy a shed, there's absolute experts in that product, so that when I come to buy a shed, I know that I'm talking to somebody whose opinion that I trust and that they 100% know what they're talking about. Why is this building different than the building down the street? What is the best feature about it? Have you listened to exactly what I told you as far as my needs for being here today and, in your expert opinion, what is going to be the best option for me? I think you're right, Shannon. I think that there is a bit of that. Let's just kind of see how they do, and I think there is a huge sort of space there that could be filled with some really great training to make sure that those guys are really experts in what they're taught.
SHED GEEK:Yeah, I think about that a lot in terms of well, I mean, you know one area that me and you, where the rubber meets the road for both you and I is like selling RTO you know selling a payment option. Selling RTO, you know, selling a payment option you know they represent ultimately as a third party sort of you know your brand. So like the last thing you want to do is get a phone call from a customer that's upset, that feels like they didn't get the information. Now, don't get me wrong. I've never known a customer to lie Ben, I don't know about you. It's never happened. It never happens.
BEN EICHSTEADT:I've never known a customer to lie in. I don't know about you. It's never happened. It never happens.
SHED GEEK:I've been in business. So, it's, you know, I want to defend. I want to defend the dealers here and everybody else so that they feel protected. Don't get me wrong. But you know there are times too that we can tend to focus on the sale and just accomplishing the sale. We can tend to focus on the sale and just accomplishing the sale, not service after the sale and not really servicing the sale in the moment. We, you know we really want to work on the commission. You know we want to get that sale, we want to get it done. We want to get it done even more when their price shop and when they've went down to, you know such and such as shed lot down the road and then they've come over to give us an opportunity. We really want to close that. But there's a due diligence there. That's necessary that we have to do. And what's your thoughts on dealers and training, even in the RTO space as well?
BEN EICHSTEADT:I know that from EZ Pay standpoint, right, this is a constant discussion. I mean, it's the same thing with training it has to be constant, and it has to be regular. How do we reinforce the messaging? Because you're right in the sense that you know we're a third-party vendor here, but our products need to be accurately discussed with the customer so that they go into it with clear eyes. And so, you just you think of all these repetitive steps that you can do. What kind of information can I give in the portal that the dealer can see right there? What kind of information can I put in, you know, a pamphlet that can be at the lot, pamphlet that can be at the lot? How many times can I schedule a conference call with the sales people or a Zoom call and let's go over the finites of our program again and again, and again.
BEN EICHSTEADT:I think that this is also where the; and this isn't just D Shedd, I think this is just sales training in general. I think that a lot of times they'll do one seminar, they'll put together one packet, they'll go over things once. It's not right. Sales is a, it's not a binary thing, it's a living, breathing, moving sort of craft and it has to be constantly refined and the fundamentals have to be constantly reinforced. I mean, if you look at some of the, I read this book about Kobe Bryant one time and they said for every practice, for his whole career, he spent the first hour doing drills. He did in seventh grade. Right, he's working on the fundamentals and even though he was at the top of his industry, that piece why he was at the top is because he never let go of that piece and we don't see that enough on the sales side or the product discussion side in the shed, or the steel industry, to be honest.
SHED GEEK:I love the basketball analogy especially. I've used often use the one, you know, ai and no, not artificial intelligence, but Alan Iverson, the original AI, and the notorious commercial or press conference where he says practice. You know it's turned into a commercial now practice, we're not talking about the game, we're talking about practice. You know, and I love AI and he was a great basketball player but practice is really where, you know, 90% of the of the process is. You know, the game is really just executing the fundamentals and the practice. So, I've said for years I'm a big fan of like taking the time to like really build a strong process behind the scenes so that what is apparent, uh, it just becomes natural and it's. You know, instead of 10 practice and 90 game, let's focus on 90% practice and 10% game. The game should just feel natural.
ADVERTISEMENT:Introducing Shed Hub, your ultimate shed marketplace. Are you in the shed business and looking to connect with more buyers? Look no farther than Shed Hub. Look no farther than Shed Hub. Shed Hub is a game-changing two-sided marketplace that brings shed sellers and buyers together in one easy-to-use platform. Think of it as the Amazon of sheds. Shed Hub isn't just any ordinary marketplace. It's a powerhouse that ranks on the first page of Google search results in 91% of US cities, with over 1.2 million impressions on our website last month alone. Shed Hub is where you want to be to showcase your sheds to a wider audience. And here's the best part; For a limited time, you can join our exclusive Next 500 plan for just $39 per month. Simply head over to geek. shedhub. com to sign up and start attracting more shoppers to your shed listings.
ADVERTISEMENT:As the Shed Geek, I am here to indorse Shed Hub and to invite you to join me on this journey to boost your shed business. Whether you're struggling with website visibility or simply want more eyes on your product Shed Hub has got you covered. Don't miss out on this opportunity to supercharge your shed sales. Visit geek. shedhub. com today and make your mark in the shed industry with Shed Hub.
SHED GEEK:You said something about them becoming a customer and it sort of jogged my mind into one particular place, ben, that I'm curious your thoughts. You know their customer that uses a our RTO right. Like they come in, they use EZ Pay's RTO or whoever's RTO company out there. They ultimately have that lead in attracting that customer and then being a customer of theirs. But where we're unique is they become our customer too, and even become our customer longer, so we actually end up having the relationship with them. They don't see, including the fact that don't get me wrong, ben, every customer always pays their bills on time.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Oh yeah, without question, 100%. We never had that problem.
SHED GEEK:But in the small event that there's someone or someone who don't pay on time, you know that relationship becomes very crucial to the RTO company because it's ultimately, it's their customer as well. What are some of your thoughts on those issues that you see? What can we do?
BEN EICHSTEADT:better. I think that actually can dovetail into a big conversation. It has to do with just sort of your overall individual company goals, right? And I think that, whether they're based on volume, whether they're based on gross profit per unit, whatever your overall company goals are going to shape the practices that you use.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Ultimately, though, for both, no matter what, you want customers to continue to make payments. So I think, two things we do our very best to be as transparent as possible with customers going into it, and the other thing is, you know, at the end of the day, I'm going to continuously work with them, whether that's moving payments on the back end, whether that's coming up with different arrangements, but if I can continue to get some revenue from them in some way I mean from the RTO side that's an awful lot better than having to go get it or having them turn it in. You know I'll take a hundred bucks a week and we'll tack on some on the back end of the contract rather than you just stop responding and stop calling. You know that's. The other hurdle, too is what do you do when customers just stop engaging with you? From the RTO side? That's a tough one.
SHED GEEK:Yeah, I'm almost curious your thoughts. You know I've seen it both ways. I've seen dealers or manufacturers both that really want an opportunity to work with that customer yeah, Should communication failure break down. And then I've seen some who say, hey, your risk, your problem it's the business you got into. You're an RTO, so I sold the building, I did my part. You know it's not my problem that you're having a hard time reaching the customer. What approach is the best approach?
BEN EICHSTEADT:I don't know if there's a best approach. I think there's good approaches for different circumstances. I will say this I will oftentimes reach out to the dealer, right, because this is the person who built the initial rapport, built the initial relationship, and I'll say, hey, listen, you know Tom Jones just won't respond to us. I know you told me some, you know you got to know him during your sales process. Is there any chance that you can reach out to him and just say, hey, EZ Pay would like to talk to you. You're not in trouble, we'd like to connect with you. So, I will go as far to those avenues. Are there times where there are no other options? Of course not. So, you're going to repossession and they're going to court. I mean, you can't just keep doing the same thing with no result. But you can try different things.
BEN EICHSTEADT:And using the dealer who did the sale at the sale point and built that initial partnership is definitely something that I lean on from time to time and that only works if I have a good rapport with that dealer, right, if we're both operating in full transparency with each other, which is what we try to do. We try to build solid partnerships, and the trust is built over time so that I can call that guy and say because I don't fault the salesperson, I get that they're either trying to hit a number, or they want that. You know they're trying to hit a certain commission. They want that. You know they're trying to hit a certain commission. But I do want to make sure that when they're talking about EZ Pay, they're being as transparent with that customer as possible so that in the event that they stop communicating with me, I could go back to that dealer and say hey, can you give Tom a call and see if he'll reach out to us?
SHED GEEK:Yeah, I have found that communication is well. It's an unusual thing. There was a saying something along the line of I'm not sure that communication is the communication. All we've really done is touch it on the surface. I'm sort of curious. It sounds like you have an awesome partnership with, with dealers and manufacturers that you partner with. What are sort of your thoughts on? You know the. If I get too deep in the woods here, let me know the. Uh, if I get too deep in the woods here, let me know uh, but. But I'm curious your thoughts on, like the competitive nature of like the RTO world. You know, uh, just over the past five years, uh, how do we keep it positive? And you know what's your relationship like with other RTO companies. What do you like to see, what? What do you hope to see? What's just your thoughts on it?
BEN EICHSTEADT:I mean, I think that there are. I think there was a time and again. You know, I've been here since August of 2020. And I think that there was a time where there was real secrecy behind the different companies and their various programs. Right, well, we've now gotten into the place in the industry where companies often use more than one company, so there is somewhat transparency into each other's programs.
BEN EICHSTEADT:I do think that there are some areas where I would not want to do anything to impede on anybody's what they believe is their competitive edge and what they're trying to accomplish. I do think, when it comes to sheds and rent to own, there are absolutely some common grounds that we could work together to come up. We all know that there are dealers in specific areas that are just bad news. I mean, I've run into dealers that I know my competitors have turned away from, so that's going to give me cause. I've had dealers where I've actually called another competitor and say, listen, this is our experience. And wouldn't it be great if there just was kind of a blacklist that we could all reference before going into an agreement with anybody and say, okay, this, this and this. I'm not saying we need to come together and open up our business plans for everybody in all aspects. But I think in that particular one there is some common ground that we could come together on.
ADVERTISEMENT:Digital Shed Builder is an online shed configurator that strives to provide incredible visual quality, fantastic customer service and an amazingly low price point, making it a perfect fit for any shed dealer looking to increase their online sales. Digital Shed Builder is simple to use, taking less than five minutes to integrate on your site. The get a quote feature streamlines your sales process, showing you exactly what your potential customers need. They offer a highly customizable experience that accurately represents your brand and unique shed offerings, working with you directly to set up everything you need in a configurator, with no extra startup cost, no lengthy contracts or commitments and no hidden fees.
ADVERTISEMENT:Digital Shed Builder has been created with quality, simplicity and
ADVERTISEMENT:affordability in mind.
SHED GEEK:It just seems like, you know, the more organized the dealers get in doing, you know, bad deeds.
SHED GEEK:That ultimately affects everyone, and you know there should be enough common ground to say, hey, you know this was a bad experience, bad experience, uh, I, I don't know, uh, and I think those are good reasons to attend things like the NBSRA to learn more about that, to try and figure out the you know the legal ramifications and what's allowed and what's not. But it's certainly good to try and organize at least enough not to cause any harm yeah, any particular business, but so to organize for the benefit of, of our industry, to, you know cause, like we don't, we don't, we don't really want. You know I don't know about you, but I know I've never been the biggest fan of, like you know, reality TV. You know, like where they're showing cars getting repossessed and all the hydra that goes with it, because television has to have that. But you know, I don't always like that being representative of our products too.
SHED GEEK:Whenever I read through the comment section that says, you know, I didn't even know a shed could be repossessed, how pathetic, or something along those lines, I can just tell that the consumer base is not educated and sometimes, let's be honest, you know we haven't done the best job, even internally in the industry as dealers, manufacturers, RTO of representing what rent to own stands for. It'd be nice that the consumer base sort of understands what we're doing and understands what a rent-to-own program is and how it differs from a credit sale.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Yeah, yeah, I agree with you 100%. And I could even extrapolate that further and say hey, you know, I'd like to see us wholeheartedly, as an industry, do a little bit of a better job in front of some state legislatures. Because there is listen, rent to own is a, it's not even an optional. It is a vital service for a good segment of our customers. It is how they go about their lives. It is how they go about their lives and should they be turned down from getting things that they need because they don't have this credit, that credit or this established or that established? The answer to that is no, right.
BEN EICHSTEADT:And it's one of those things where I'll bet, if I talk to customers because I have on an individual basis, because you're always going to get the question well, why is it such an expensive way to buy a building? And when you start to break down the risks involved for buying that asset the fact that when one building goes into repossession after one payment, that I have to have X number of successful contracts to make up for just that one loss, just that one loss they start to understand that more. So, I think you're right. I mean, I haven't figured out the best way to sort of educate the public, you know, overall, in general, and certainly not on any bigger stage, but I do think that I also not the smartest person in the room as well. I mean, I think there's some collaboration there that the industry could do to really come up with some different ways or some better materials to really educate people on the benefits of and the service of, rent-to-own.
SHED GEEK:Yeah, I love your thoughts on it. It seems like if we can't come together on nothing, we can come together on a few of those ideas for sure that are mutually beneficial for the industry as a whole. And I don't know, you know who, who will take the reins, you know, for that particular discussion. But you know I definitely like the direction that it's going. It seems to be that you know there's, like you said, not just the secrecy in red tone but the secrecy in the shed industry as a whole.
SHED GEEK:You know, I remember working somewhere where we couldn't go into the R&D department and we worked there and it was like, oh man, like it's going to hit the street and the neighbor across the road is going to see it and they're going to understand what they're competing up against. Almost. I say that all the time. I mean, you're probably going to find a similar thing in most cases within five to 10 percent from one shed company to the next. You're probably going to see that in marketing. You're probably going to see that in rent to own, it's your systems and processes that really set you apart. It's oftentimes not even your product in some cases.
BEN EICHSTEADT:No, there are some small things I agree with you Like. One of them is simply being accessible. That alone can increase your sales, your volume, your profits tremendously, if you are there or if you answer the phone, if you return phone calls, if you return texts.
SHED GEEK:You're going to open up a can in a minute.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Yeah, I mean the smallest steps that you can do, that you would do it consistently, you'll see dramatic increases. Being accessible is one of them, and I see a lot of people that could make improvements in that area, and it's also one of those kind of fundamentals that I talk about, and I try to practice what I preach. I mean, I try to be as accessible as possible and I'm always looking at all right, what did I miss here? How can I improve this? How can I be reached better here? That small thing picking up the phone.
SHED GEEK:And how can you even escalate that as you begin to scale a business, as it gets larger? As you said, you guys are in 30 states. I mean, you think to yourself, you know, five years ago or 10 years ago or 15 years ago, if you were a rent to own space or it didn't even have to be rent to own, it can just be a as, as a as a CEO, where you were not once CEO, you saw the processes more clearly. Now you have to organize them. You're a project manager of all of these processes and you know, I always say, if there's something you want to this little red book of sales.
SHED GEEK:Jeffrey Gittimer taught me this. He said if there's anything you want to know about a company, call their salespeople. Their salespeople want to sell. So call their salespeople and just talk to the salespeople and it's. It really is that simple. Well, people start to feel the need to protect that right. I mean, like, obviously we don't spend all day calling salespeople and eavesdropping on companies. I'm just saying, like they want to get a sale. So they're, they're ready to tell you everything about what they do and and and how they do it, because they're always seeing the person on the other side of the phone as a potential customer, and my question is how do you scale that up then as you begin to grow and you begin to scale as a business in general? I don't know if you ever played a telephone game where you stand on one hand.
SHED GEEK:Yeah, 100%, yeah, yeah, ever played a telephone game where you stand on one yeah, 100 yeah. But that's the way it feels like it works in business, like the CEO or the, the executive team sets out a plan and by the time it gets to the end of the telephone, end of the line. There you know it's like it's not. It doesn't even look similar. Right in you discussed how do you increase that communication, even when you need to scale, so that manufacturers, dealers, the part-time employee, the person who just has a sales lot, that they never man it but they still take phone calls. How can they best represent not only their manufacturer but EZ Pay?
BEN EICHSTEADT:Yeah, I think that's a complex question that probably has a myriad of answers. One thing that I will say is it's consistency of message. So I want to. For instance, if I have a territory manager who wants my job someday, I am more than happy to help him get there right. But in a sense I need to replace myself, so I need to make sure that he is sort of being as consistent as I would be with the messaging and how we handle issues. If I'm a manufacturer and I've got, like you say, I've got corporate sales slots and then I have these other sales lots, and how do I keep the messaging consistent? There's a variety of things that you can do. One of them is pretty simply like just blind stoppings Right. We can sort of check on how that conversation is going. But again, we tend to do a training, we do a training seminar. Maybe we do it once a year, maybe we do it twice a year. It's a thing that needs to be talked about on a daily and weekly basis.
SHED GEEK:Yeah.
BEN EICHSTEADT:You know, when you are the guy on the lot and you should be in a position or you should want to really sort of analyze your sales meetings with potential customers, they come to the lot. You know, were they there for 15 minutes and they left and they didn't get a sale? Did they come, say their name and leave right away? Were you there for an hour and a half and did they still not buy a building? If you're not analyzing what happened in those conversations, you are doomed to repeat it.
ADVERTISEMENT:At IFAB LLC, our passion is welding, fabricating and design. That's why, in 2015, we begin to commercially market our product to the shed, portable building and minibarn industry. Our product is primarily used to build trusses. Minibarn industry Our product is primarily used to build trusses. Our truss saw system cuts boards in one motion and our truss press system installs and presses the gusset plates to a finished truss. We custom fabricate jigs that assure perfectly symmetrical truss setup without error. We also have other products designed to help your shed builder increase quality, efficiency and save money. Our precision door table will build your custom doors square every time and easily adjust to build any door for your barn shop. Visit ifabllc. com or call 563-422-7496 or simply email us at ifabllc@ gmail. com.
SHED GEEK:Yeah, I love it. I always love.
SHED GEEK:One of my favorite podcasts is called the communication guys and I always love the idea of the thought of communication because I've said for years and I'll continue to say, I think good communication, comprehensive communication, I think it can solve so many problems. You know, if the matters of the heart are right, then communication is really the key. It's the icing on the cake. If we can just get the matters of the heart right, good, effective communication can solve hunger. I believe that it can stop wars. I believe that if we can learn to communicate at a maximum efficiency. I understand that that's probably a bit naive and I'm okay with saying that, but I tell this all the time I'm going to take a, I'm going to ad lib here.
SHED GEEK:Anyone who's been around me has heard this story, ben. So you know, if we were in a plane and the plane was going down, everyone's going to be freaking out and I'm probably the guy that's going to go. Huh, I did not see this coming. I did not. This was not the way I thought I would go. People say, oh, that's not true, you'll be up in arms. I said you know, it's funny, the things that are outside of my control, I can't control that plane. I can't make it stop. I can't make it fly. I can't make it stop, I can't make it fly, I can't make it do anything. It's the things that are outside of my control I'm able to let go of very easily. It's the day to day menial task that stress me out, sure.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Yeah, why can't I communicate effectively right now with this guy?
SHED GEEK:I'm really trying to figure it out. It's not working, or why can't those two people get on the same page? They could just do so many great things together if they could. Those are the things that worry me, Ben.
BEN EICHSTEADT:And I look at that scenario and I look at how I communicate with my own team and sort of my own dealers, and the one thing that I do my best at is to really stop and listen and allow people to ask as many questions as they need to. I've sort of learned over the years that we all process information differently. We've all run across this where we're using different words but we're talking about the same thing. So how do I get that code to connect?
BEN EICHSTEADT:And the only way that I found and certainly again, there are much smarter people who know other ways I'm going to let the person ask as many questions as they can possibly think of and if they have to ask them over and over again, and I will give them whatever answers I can. And at some point, you know, at least I'm finding that they are able to take those answers in the way that they process information and make it into something that makes sense to them. So I think a big part of communication is actually in the listening. I have worked for people and with people who I don't know if they really like to hear themselves talk, but they seem to. They just keep trying to get their point across, or talking and talking, and they're not really accomplishing it. So I, at least for me personally. What methodology works for me is I do try to give pause to everybody, no matter what the subject is, to ask as many questions as they can think of.
SHED GEEK:I love your spirit on that. I've often said you know, as a podcaster, you'd think I spend a lot of time talking, but I've spent much of my life listening, because it's the interesting part is hearing their answer and their thoughts on it. It's the only thing that you know. I can only reverberate what I've been taught and I have to listen to teach. So that's why I love these interviews, is because I feel like you can learn from everyone, no matter who they are or what they're doing, if you can communicate effectively and we've heard all of the sayings, right, you know, like two ears, one mouth. You know better to be thoughtful and stay silent than open your mouth, remove all doubt.
SHED GEEK:But also, I do love to spend a lot of time consuming information reading, listening, audio books, music. You know documentaries because its music. You know documentaries because it's just, you know, just being inquisitive um gives you like more questions that you can ask, and that's sort of the sales process. We've kind of done full circle here to come back to the sales process, haven't we asking questions?
BEN EICHSTEADT:that discovery part of the conversation is the biggest one.
BEN EICHSTEADT:You know. If you give it a second and you allow a little bit of silence during this period of the discussion is not a bad thing, because more times than not, if you give it a second, that customer is going to lead you right where they want to go. They're going to let you know exactly what they want and they're going to look for you to give them that solution. The other nice thing is during that discovery and during that listening like you being the expert in the product that you're talking about they're also going to open up windows in that discussion to where you can say well, have you thought about it this way and maybe you want to go a little bit upscale, maybe you want a little bit bigger building, in case in case, in case. So you're going to have opportunities to upsell. But at the end of the day too, you won't be sort of guessing at what that customer wants. They will lead you right to where they want to go. So that discovery part of the conversation is crucial.
SHED GEEK:I've said it many times, I'll say many more I've never had a customer come back and say you sold me too big of a building. It was always you sold me too small of a building. And then they often dig in a little deeper and say you should have pressed harder, you should have asked more questions because, like, I would have bought a bigger building because that's what I needed. So it's really just understanding the needs of the customer, that transfer of enthusiasm, it does the rest, you know. But asking the right questions and just like being genuinely interested in, like, what are you using this for? You know how can I best service you? And if you can find a way to be genuine and not just put on the mask, there's, there's something special in the in communication that happens then, because it's, it's almost unspoken. I can't really put my finger on what happens.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Whenever that authenticity is, I I can tell you like I mean that's that's a really great way to put it, because I can tell you that the big purchases that I've made in my life, whether it's, you know, cars or buildings or something like that, ultimately at the end of the day, I'm not just buying the thing, I'm buying the person selling it to me. Yes, yes, I mean 100%. And so when you go back to the beginning of when we talk about training and consistency of message, that person needs to see the lot manager, the salesperson, whoever, as the absolute expert in the field and the products that they're talking about, because at the end of the day, I'm going to buy you as much as I'm going to buy the building.
SHED GEEK:Yeah, absolutely. I believe that thoroughly. And it doesn't matter what industry you're in. If you're in sales, you know that you're in the people business. You just happen to be selling sheds. You know, if it were, if we were in motorcycles, it'd be the same story. Or computer sales It'd be the same story. Or tractors, you know you might find names like, like Apple, and you know Harley Davidson and John Deere. All of a sudden, you know, so they, they learned the people process and they just curtailed it to their particular product.
SHED GEEK:It's so easy as a young salesperson to really be passionate about your product and want to want to become a product specialist. And you know, sometimes we forget even me and you having these conversations here. We're on a podcast talking about the shed industry. But the consumer, you know they don't put that much time into it. You know they typically want to invest in the salesperson and they want to know that you know your stuff. But they really just want you to be relatable and listen and hear them and service them.
ADVERTISEMENT:Are you a dealer who sells multiple products at your shed lot? Are you tired of sifting through clunky or overcomplicated softwares to simply sell a product? If so, it's time to call Cal. Consumer Aligned Logistics is the affordable, simplified and scalable solution for your shed, carport or even RTO company. We are partnered with IdeaRoom and Shedpro for configurators and have multiple RTO partners to choose from, from JMAG to Heartland to Shed Geek Rentals and Scott's RTO, and if your partner isn't listed here, just ask. We are happy to add more. Give us a call at 425-359-3279 or visit calcanhelp. com. That's C-A-L-C-A-N-H-E-L-P. com.
SHED GEEK:Ben, tell me we've tried to work hard to make this a non-commercial for EZ Pay, but tell me a little bit more about EZ Pay
SHED GEEK:, especially for those who want to get in touch with you. What are you guys doing? You're doing, you know, metal buildings. You're doing wood buildings.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Yeah, we do them both. We do wood buildings, we do steel buildings. Like I said, we sort of we operate in 30 different states. We have at least on the books you know about 2200 different dealer partners that we're very excited about. You know all of them using us to various quantities or not. EZ Pay has been around for well I think this is its 20th year and what I found interesting about it what I got here is, for as long as they've been around and as big a book of sort of a market cap as they have, they're really good at staying invisible. They don't. We historically haven't done much to just let people know that we're in the industry, the various facets of our programs and why we're different from some of the other people in our space. So I again really appreciate the opportunity to come and talk to you and hopefully you know slowly, sort of kind of change that trend a little bit.
SHED GEEK:Well, we love it. We love building relationships, we love seeing the industry move forward as a whole. We're unique ourself in that we're in the industry and then we have a podcast to cover. But we always welcome anyone on the show and I like to put that out there because I like to say, hey, if you're not on the show, it's not because you're not invited, not because you're not asked. You're more than welcome to come on here, talk about your product. Because I believe that conversation again, it comes back to communication good conversation and communication can happen even whenever you compete or, uh, you know, like matter of fact, it's some of the best conversation because, uh, you know, it helps us all strive to be better individually, as a company and as a whole, as the industry. So I love to have even hard questions, hard conversation. I've built, matter of fact, my faith has been built on some of the most challenging times. I feel like it's why the Lord says that we should embrace difficulty and challenges, because it's where a lot of character is built.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Yeah, agreed, and I would also say just in any business, not just our industry, but in any industry a lot of times your best partnerships are formulated when there is a problem, and how do you respond and how do you react? It's pretty easy to be in a good mood when things are going great right, Just individually and as a company. How do you respond when things aren't so? It's along those same lines, I mean, and I think that those types of fires are where the best partnerships are forged.
SHED GEEK:Man, failing your way to success is the best way. I used to think that failing was like oh no, there's something you know ultimately wrong with me or whatever. And it's like you know, I get a rumor back that somebody says, well, that guy failed in this area. And they're like well, I heard this and I'm like, yeah, absolutely I did. That's terrible, taught me some of the hardest lessons I ever learned. But what it taught me more than anything was not how to fail that way anymore and then how to help others not fail that way. And that changes your whole perspective when all of a sudden it's like, yeah, you just sort of embrace it and then you can learn from it. I've never been so smart. I can't learn a little bit more?
BEN EICHSTEADT:What's the? And I think that we touched on this a little bit before we might've started, but I love this quote in it. The quote is if you are the smartest person in the room, you are the smartest person in the room. You are in the wrong room and that is 100% accurate.
SHED GEEK:Yeah, absolutely. I always want to have a little circle sphere of influence of people that I like to talk to and bounce things off of and ideas. I feel like it's great to have that in your pocket. Ben, tell me a little bit about yourself. We know about EZ Pay. We've talked about the industry. We'll have to do this again because I want to get your thoughts on where it's going. So, I'd love to have you come back again sometime too. But tell me a little bit about Ben. Who is Ben?
BEN EICHSTEADT:So, my name is Ben Eichsteadt, so I have a German last name. I grew up in New York City but I have a stepfather with a German last name, so around a bunch of New York Italians there's. You know me with the German last name. So, you want to talk about growing up in some adversity and just kind of you know getting your feet under you at a young age and just kind of you know getting your feet under you at a young age. Went to college in Ohio, blessed, to have a wonderful wife and two kids, five and two and a half and my son.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Before we had my daughter, I was in a different career where I was on airplanes about 35 weeks a year, and when we had our daughter, my wife said listen, I'm okay with you work, traveling, but maybe not every single week Can you find something else? And so opportunities happened, conversations occurred and things led to coming to EZ Pay and it's been a learning curve, as it is for anybody. It's a funny thing about this industry because, to say it even to my neighbors, you know this is the industry that I work in and they kind of give you this kind of like glazed over. Look, I did not know just the number of moving parts. I would have had no concept of the number of moving parts that are in this industry without being in it. So for me it's been great, it's been a terrific learning experience. I'm not an Ohio native but my wife is, so I'm slowly trying to continue to embrace, embrace Ohio. Fortunately, we get to travel quite a bit as a family, and that's pretty much it.
SHED GEEK:That's great man. I love it. Definitely hoping to see you in September.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Yes absolutely
SHED GEEK:At the expo. Hopefully we can meet up, but love to just chat with you anytime you're available, love your spirit and your thoughts on these different things and your answers. Yeah, we would love to continue to have you on the show. We'd love to continue to have any other RTO company or marketing company or podcaster, it really doesn't matter. I believe good communication happens whenever people come together in a spirit of cooperation and really seek what's best, not just for each other but for the industries that they represent as well too. I just think it's a great opportunity. So happy now to be doing some columns both in Shed Business Journal and Garage Shed Carport Builder.
SHED GEEK:We've tried to attend several trade shows. We want to attend all of the hollerbashes and breakfast or any sales related things. So anything that you invite us to that doesn't allow us to come in and creep into your business and take away any competitive advantage, we're more than happy to come. We want to be part of anything we can be, as long as travel schedules allow. But I usually give the interviewee an opportunity to turn the microphone around and ask questions, no matter what it's about. Podcasting, sales sheds faith. You know whatever you want to do, and I try to catch them off guard, especially if they haven't listened to a lot of the episodes as of late. But for the last 20 or 30 shows we've been turning the microphone around and saying do you have any questions at all for Shannon the shed geek? Is there anything I can answer? I'll give it my best shot. If you don't have any, it's okay, but I figure we'll give it a try.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Well, I am curious, In the time that you've been doing the podcast, have you sort of noticeably seen just your own perceptions of the industry, your ideas on the industry kind of change and morph Like? Have you changed your stance on anything in particular or looked at something in a new light that maybe you hadn't before you started this great opportunity to talk to so many people?
SHED GEEK:Good question, great question. I love the question. Yeah, we're three years in now. You know I've been doing this for three years. I've been doing this on my own for, you know, over two of those years and you know one, I still love it. You know we're well over 200 shows. We're doing a podcast expansion that's already live now by the time this episode comes out, where we have others that are helping to co-host, because, yes, some things have changed.
SHED GEEK:You know, I have grown individually. I've grown in my own, my assumptions of things that I assumed either being on an island or being unaware. You know, when you're left, not knowing a person like I, can only assume things about EZ Pay. Yeah, you know what I mean. I don't know without talking to you. And I don't know that without talking to other companies either. Don't know that without talking to other companies either. You know, yeah, if it's a dealer, a manufacturer, a hauler, somebody who wants to get their product out, if it's someone in post frame.
SHED GEEK:You know, we just attended the post frame show and, uh, one thing that surprised me is, you know, I heard a statistic that said that 40 of post frame builders are also, uh, selling sheds or building sheds, manufacturing sheds and you thinkeds manufacturing sheds? And you think, well, we're just in the shed industry. But if you go up to Michigan and they see a 30 by 40 pole barn post frame built out there, a lot of times they just call it their shed. That's my shed in the backyard and we think of sheds as portable structures, outbuildings and just so my perception of the word itself shed, shed, geek, what is that? What is it? Who are you Like? You know, why are you not learning about role formers? Because so many guys that are doing sheds on their own role former and then they're bending their own metal and they're putting them on their sheds, how come you're not, uh, you know, invest in a? I'll tell you why is because where does it stop? You know, some guys build homes too, and like I'm not the shed or the home builder geek, I don't know.
SHED GEEK:But you know, construction is sort of at the root of what we do as manufacturers. And then the rest of the conversation starts to happen. You've got to build something to have something to sell. You got to sell something to have something to haul. But how do the intricacies of the different parts of our businesses exist? Because, yeah, I mean I'm learning so much more about post frame and metal. You know carports, I mean, we sold from there for a while. But like yeah, I'm so interested to jump into that industry a little bit more so that we can sort of understand. You know even how to help organize there. I've heard shed dealers say I don't even want to sell carports anymore because the lead times or the customer service isn't there, and it's like well, hey, there's another communication topic and like how do we get in front of these folks to talk about how to make these situations better? It's like you're attempting to finish a job that can't be finished yet. The podcasts are like we're always striving for better, never reaching perfection.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Yeah, yeah, that's interesting yeah.
SHED GEEK:I like that Some of my stuff has changed. There's no doubt Some of my opinions have changed. I've met some wonderful people like yourself and others by doing this.
BEN EICHSTEADT:I think that it should, right. I mean, I think one of the first things that we all look for in people is a mind at work, and I don't think that your mind can be at work if you're just, if you're solely fixated on one's belief in something or one. You know, this is how it has to be thing, so I love that.
SHED GEEK:You know, in some cases you just don't know if you don't call someone up and talk to them or reach out or have some mutual conversation or friend that can connect you somehow, it just it works out, so that you know. That's what's changed the most for me is like my perception of people and companies, and you know that's great, that that's changed the most, because I was left with my own thoughts and your thoughts can be toxic if you don't really know and experience for yourself. So that's why I love doing this. I'm a genuine conversationalist at heart. I love these conversations and I've got friends that I'll never even work with in this industry Never. We'll never make a dollar off each other and I feel like we're going to be lifelong friends and that to me, is I don't know. That's probably the best thing that could have came out of this. I think.
BEN EICHSTEADT:Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is the biggest measure of a man can be measured in his impact on others, or how many other people he's affected. There's some great phrase that goes along with that that I don't remember the exact wording, but impact on others is is, you know, probably the biggest currency that we all have man.
SHED GEEK:That's a great statement. I, I, we were. I was at a video shoot this morning. That's why I seemed tired. I was up at 5 am and we were shooting a video at six. We had this podcast at nine and I, I, all we were talking about this morning was like purpose and why not how. You do it Right, you know, kind of like the Simon Sinek. You know, find your why, not how and not what and all that, but why, what, what drives you? Why do you get up, why do you do what you do? And like, I think that whenever you can begin to find that, you can find a level of contentment that money can't purchase and that's something of a comment I made this morning. So, I agree with you, one of the best currencies out there can be. You know your purpose. I think, yeah, a hundred percent man, a hundred percent man. I don't know how to end it any better, unless you have any other questions. I hope I answered it. I tend to have long answers.
BEN EICHSTEADT:No, no, that was great. I was just curious on your take on it. That was great and I really did, man, we could. I'd be happy to come on and talk about steel. We can talk about that forever, but to talk about it anytime. This is a really great experience. I really enjoyed it.
SHED GEEK:Well, hey, I love it. I've heard nothing but good things about your company and wishing you guys the absolute best. I think it's great what you do Just love getting to meet you. You know, nothing happens without networking. Networking works if you work it. So, yeah, perfect. Hey, this is Mo Lunsford in sunny Union Grove, North Carolina, and we want to say thank you to all the guests and listeners.